Let's give it away!! - Absolute waste? Now Cameron spends foreign aid budget on £6bn global climate change bill

I have heard that Cameron is to up the spending on Foreign Aid from 12 Billion pounds to 15 Billion in the near future.  I can think of better things to spend it on than giving Foreign goverments  the chance to line their own pockets at the expense of our own people!     Fucking disgusting.

Nicko do you have a link to this please?

Eddie, can't give a link, it was on BBC news yesterday. It will be mentioned again i'm sure.

nicko wrote:Eddie,    can't give a link,   it was on BBC news yesterday. It will be mentioned again i'm sure.

I was enjoying today until I read this increase.

Givem bugga all.

Our own people are neglected, look after them first, second and third.

Who do he think he am giving away our dosh which will be used on crooked schemes to line the pockets of bleeding criminals.

It's okay Nicko I found this:
(Apologies as it's the Express lol)


Absolute waste? Now Cameron spends foreign aid budget on £6bn global climate change bill

THE Prime Minister has sparked outrage after announcing nearly £6billion of British taxpayers' money will be spent tackling climate change around the world.

The Government will boost its spending by at least 50 per cent on reducing carbon emissions among the world's poorest nations, as well as helping those countries combat the effects of climate change.

Over the next six years, Mr Cameron will hand over £5.8billion of taxpayers cash to the Government's International Climate Fund (ICF).

The Prime Minister announced the boost in funding during a lunch at the United Nations in New York yesterday, ahead of a global climate change summit in Paris this November.

The money will come from the Government's controversial foreign aid bill, on which Mr Cameron is legally obliged to spend 0.7 per cent of Britain's Gross Domestic Product (GDP).

As well causing anger among his political opponents, Mr Cameron's announcement could also cause disharmony among his own Tory backbenchers, with many of them fierce critics of the UK's aid obligations.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/608518/foreign-aid-global-climate-change-British-taxpayers-David-Cameron-6bn

Interesting that nicko would post the exact same headline as this Express story from two months ago, then claim that he just saw it on TV the other day.

To be fair, perhaps this wasnt the story he meant?
I just googled Cameron spending foreign aid and this was the latest article.

You calling me a liar shit face, I don't read the express, I heard the statement on tv a couple of days ago.

If anyone still doesn't believe me about the slight warming in recent couple hundred years is just a recovery to normal temps as we come out of the period known as the mini ice age, and it is completely about the sun kicking out a bit more energy etc...

The proof of this can be clearly seen by the fact that in recent years the northern lights can be regularly seen much further south than what we consider to be 'normal'...!


This can only mean one thing!!!


And that is undeniably an increase in solar activity!!!


With another result of this increased solar activity being a bit more heat!!!


Why do some find this simple evidence based logical conclusion, so hard to understand/accept...!!!???

AN apology from Ben would be nice,

but I wont hold my breath.

Tommy Monk wrote:If anyone still doesn't believe me about the slight warming in recent couple hundred years is just a recovery to normal temps as we come out of the period known as the mini ice age, and it is completely about the sun kicking out a bit more energy etc...

The proof of this can be clearly seen by the fact that in recent years the northern lights can be regularly seen much further south than what we consider to be 'normal'...!


This can only mean one thing!!!


And that is undeniably an increase in solar activity!!!


With another result of this increased solar activity being a bit more heat!!!


Why do some find this simple evidence based logical conclusion, so hard to understand/accept...!!!???


because it aint true?

says Tommy ...as he disappears in a puff of smoke

So explain why northern lights are now so regularly seen so much further south...!?

nicko wrote:AN apology from Ben would be nice,

but I wont hold my breath.

I wouldnt nicko....

quill didnt have the good grace to apologise for his foul calumny

I would expect it from ben


It seems to be an American thing....right from the top down....they dont apologise for anything....

are they really??

sound a bit like your the earth has tilted and no one has said anything nonsense...

have the been CONSISTANTLY getting more south...or is this a very recent thing like these last few months.....

which is is....

they come and go...they are driven south by a flare  of which we have had a couple,,,,

the sun is actually quiet atm...but we do catch a flare now and again...

they are NOT, consistantly, over a number of years, getting regularly more south....

so thats that theory up the spout....


trouble is tommy, you have the scientific understanding of a hamster

two items of dubious jornalism in the sun and for you its "fact", becasue it suits your ides....

try getting some real data...then get back to me......

Thing is vic... you're wrong about this... the northern lights have been increasingly visible from much more southerly points for years now!!!

raw data...

rather than your "i heard it somewhere....."

we hear this crap every time we get hit with a flare....

the rate of which is NOT on average, increasing

moreover...just becasue the lights move a bit more south to the americans means nothing...are they ALSO moving south on the opposite side of the pole...

i think you will find that on the opposite side they are actually moving more north

its due to something called "polar wandering"

whereby the magnetic polar north moves a bit , whereas of course the geographical pole doesnt move...

nicko wrote:I have heard that Cameron is to up the spending on Foreign Aid from 12 Billion pounds to 15 Billion in the near future.  I can think of better things to spend it on than giving Foreign goverments  the chance to line their own pockets at the expense of our own people!     Fucking disgusting.

Isn't this money being diverted for use from the existing overseas aid budget rather than an increase in the aid budget itself?

Increasingly regularly seen from parts of UK in recent decades...

data tommy...data

for Tommy

The Northern lights, it seems, have moved further south and have been visible from countries including Germany and Denmark. So what exactly is causing this spectacle? And how long will it last?
Image caption A recent increase in solar activity is having an effect on Earth's magnetic field (blue) and the Northern Lights

The Northern Lights, or Aurora Borealis, are caused by charged gas particles - that flow away from the Sun as a "solar wind" - interacting with the Earth's magnetic field.

This solar wind has its own magnetic field, which can "drag away" the Earth's magnetic field lines, disconnecting them from our planet.

Eventually though, the field lines "snap back" into the continuous loop that exits one of the Earth's magnetic poles and re-enters at the other. This snapping back or "reconnection" means that particles that were in the solar wind are pushed into the Earth's atmosphere.

The charged particles "excite" gases in our atmosphere and make make them glow - just like gas in a fluorescent tube. The colours depend on the type of gas - a red or green glow is oxygen and the blue and purple colours are produced by nitrogen.
Image caption The spectacular Aurora Borealis are usually only visible in the far north

The huge ejection of charged particles from the Sun on 3 August disconnected more of the Earth's magnetic field lines and when these snapped back to Earth the resulting auroras were visible much further south than usual.

Dr Colin Forsyth from the UCL's Mullard Space Science Laboratory explained that the boundary between "open" (or disconnected) field lines and the rest of the Earth's magnetic field is "where aurora are most likely to occur". And when more field lines are disconnected, that boundary moves south.

On Wednesday night stunning light displays were seen over parts of northern Europe, including Germany and Denmark, but so far scientists say there has not been "sufficient activity" over southern parts of the UK to produce a light show.

Professor Mike Kosch from Lancaster University said it was "possible but unlikely" that the Northern Lights would be visible from England on Thursday night.

He explained that the chances to view the results of the magnetic storms would be best in northern Scotland and northern parts of Europe. "They could be going on above our heads during the day, but we can't see them," he said.

The space storms can affect satellite communication systems, but satellite operators monitor the activity of the Sun to mitigate any potential problems.

The same phenomenon occurs around the southern magnetic pole and is known as the Aurora Australis or the southern polar lights.

from http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-10880852

and

for the long term effect


The northern lights are shifting south from the Arctic, and will appear more often in the skies over Ottawa in decades to come, a new study says.

The reason: Earth’s magnetic field is becoming gradually weaker, and this affects how the solar wind — charged particles from the sun — bounces off it.

In time, the aurora could reach as far as the southern United States.

“The Earth’s magnetic field more or less keeps the solar wind at bay, and it’s the solar wind interacting with the field that contributes to the auroras,” said Dennis Kent, an expert in paleomagnetism at Columbia University’s Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory.

“With a strong field, that interaction is pushed to high latitudes. With a weaker field more of the Earth is bathed in these charged particles.

“So a consequence would be that the aurora would be visible at lower latitudes.” The same is expected with the southern lights.

Kent does not count on living long enough to see the changes, “but I expect my grandson will. He’s six.”

And even today’s adults may see some progression, such as brighter or more common displays of the aurora in places like Ottawa, where it is already visible from time to time.

Kent is a co-author of a paper just published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS), a major research journal.

The paper looks at how Earth’s magnetic field is weakening, and suggests it has been abnormally high but is now retreating toward the long-term average. The field has weakened by about 10 per cent in the past two centuries.

But there’s a more important reason to study this, beyond knowing when the sky will be pretty. The magnetic field occasionally “flips” and reverses our planet’s north and south poles.

It has done this hundreds of times in the past 100 million years, most recently about 780,000 years ago. During the current weakening, some scientists have been expecting it to become unstable and flip again.

That’s unlikely for now, Kent’s team says. They estimate that the current field, despite weakening, is still stronger than the long-term average, leaving plenty of room for change without becoming unstable.

Earth scientists can chart past changes by looking at volcanic rock. As lava cools, iron-bearing minerals in it solidify and act like tiny magnets, aligning with the Earth’s magnetic field. By knowing the age of the rock, a scientist can determine which way the magnetic field was oriented and how strong it was when the rock formed, and how strong the magnetic field was.
from http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-not-so-northern-lights-aurora-moving-south-from-the-arctic-study-shows


so Tommy, nothing AT ALL to do with more output from the sun

In fact Tommy


read this...cant copy it they have their guard dog on patrol

http://phys.org/news/2015-08-solar-decliningwhat.html

I said parts of UK... northern parts of UK... not southern UK... although sometimes can be seen from Wales recently...


Can regularly be seen from parts of Scotland these days now, although only a couple of decades ago, extremely rare, almost nonexistent... would have had to travel outside of UK if you wanted to have any chance of seeing...

Plus... don't you think our own planets magnetic field and pole position is itself intrinsically linked to and driven by the varying levels of energy thrown at us from the sun...!?


Do you know anything about the direct relationship between magnetism and electricity!?

Induction...!?

EMF...!?


And you try to say that I have no knowledge of science...!!!???

Tommy Monk wrote:I said parts of UK... northern parts of UK... not southern UK... although sometimes can be seen from Wales recently...


Can regularly be seen from parts of Scotland these days now, although only a couple of decades ago, extremely rare, almost nonexistent... would have had to travel outside of UK if you wanted to have any chance of seeing...

Plus... don't you think our own planets magnetic field and pole position is itself intrinsically linked to and driven by the varying levels of energy thrown at us from the sun...!?


Do you know anything about the direct relationship between magnetism and electricity!?

Induction...!?

EMF...!?


And you try to say that I have no knowledge of science...!!!???

you are an idiot Tommy , a total plonker with the knowlege of a slalmander...

my 10yo nephew has a better understanding of this than you

the earths magnetic field is intrinsic to the earth, NOT "driven" caused by, linked to or anything else by the sun, it would exist of its own right even if the sun was absent.

the sun can influence the shape of the field outside the atmosphere granted, but it does NOT have any relationship to its strength

the pole position is NOT influenced by the sun either, being a propety of the core of the earth and how it moves.

I can assure you tommy, I know more about electricity etc that you do, it has been my career for 30 odd years....
oddly enough there IS a small opposing field generated by the conductor of the earth passing through the electrical field of the sun, but given the fact that the field is very weak

and the earths field relatively powerful in comparison, the effect is very very small

moreover I note you ignore the second post which shows the sun is in fact REDUCING in activity, which would lower both heat and electrical output....


either
you are a twat
OR
you need to do some learning.....

So nothing to do with output levels of sun you say on one hand... while also previously admitting that when we are hit by high activity solar flares then this will have direct impact on northern lights activity and how far south can be seen!!!



Do you know anything about kp levels!?


And by the way... I'm an electrical engineer...!

an electrical engineer...


a "sparky"

says a lot

erm
kp levels...yes yes tommy, the geomagnetic index,

so what...the earths magnetic field is gradually weakening...
so the kp index is shifted south...

NOTHING to do with solar activity

the only effect a solar flare has irs to drive more radiation into the earths nagnetic field, thus increasing the size of the display...temporarily...


the effects YOU are tieing in with climate change are not relevent to the climate change debate


as I have shown you ...the sun is going into a "solar minimum" which will have some minor moderating affect for a relatively short period of time...helpful, but NOT a saviour

hence ALL claims about "solar forcing" are nonsense....

Tommy Monk wrote:So explain why northern lights are now so regularly seen so much further south...!?

They are getting old and frequently take trips to Miami.

nicko wrote:You calling me a liar shit face, I don't read the express, I heard the statement on tv a couple of days ago.  

Are you calling me an idiot, doodoo head? You expect me to believe that the Express wrote an article with the headline: "Absolute waste? Now Cameron spends foreign aid budget on £6bn global climate change bill," then a TV reporter used the exact same phrase, "Absolute waste? Now Cameron spends foreign aid budget on £6bn global climate change bill," a few days ago (and a few months after the article came out), and then you pulled it word-for-word out of your memory to write: "Absolute waste? Now Cameron spends foreign aid budget on £6bn global climate change bill"?

YOUR still calling me a liar you big headed YANKY PRICK, I TOLD YOU I DON'T READ THE EXPRESS.

pull your fucking head in you twat.

Lord Foul wrote:an electrical engineer...


a "sparky"

says a lot

erm
kp levels...yes yes tommy, the geomagnetic index,

so what...the earths magnetic field is gradually weakening...
so the kp index is shifted south...

NOTHING to do with solar activity

the only effect a solar flare has irs to drive more radiation into the earths nagnetic field, thus increasing the size of the display...temporarily...


the effects YOU are tieing in with climate change are not relevent to the climate change debate


as I have shown you ...the sun is going into a "solar minimum" which will have some minor moderating affect for a relatively short period of time...helpful, but NOT a saviour

hence ALL claims about "solar forcing" are nonsense....

So nothing to do with output levels of sun you say on one hand... while also previously admitting that when we are hit by high activity solar flares then this will have direct impact on northern lights activity and how far south can be seen!!!


Most amusing!!!

you said .......

Tommy Monk wrote:If anyone still doesn't believe me about the slight warming in recent couple hundred years is just a recovery to normal temps as we come out of the period known as the mini ice age, and it is completely about the sun kicking out a bit more energy etc...

The proof of this can be clearly seen by the fact that in recent years the northern lights can be regularly seen much further south than what we consider to be 'normal'...!


This can only mean one thing!!!


And that is undeniably an increase in solar activity!!!

the evidence is its getting less


With another result of this increased solar activity being a bit more heat!!!

which makes the above just plain daft


Why do some find this simple evidence based logical conclusion, so hard to understand/accept...!!!???

becasue its based on wrong evidence as I have shown you

Solar activity is decreasing

the earths magnetic field is also decreasing but at a relatively faster rate

hence the aurorae move equator wise

the odd flare has NO effect on global temperature (well, not a measurable one anyway...)

like a spark from a bonfire contributes a negligible amount to the heat output of the fire...

a flare will and always has pushed the aurorae out a bit, the effect will probably increase as the earths magnetic field falls....though generally the effect has been more to increase the light show...

the argument isnt how the flares affect the aurorae Tommy,
the argunent is the absurd premise you made as above.....



I always knew mere sparky's were as thick as two short planks

http://www.space.com/2942-sun-activity-increased-century-study-confirms.html


Also... you claim the earths magnetic field has weakened in recent years/decades...

Firstly, can you provide evidence for this?

Secondly, can you provide any conclusive evidence explaining why (if at all) this would be happening... and how this would be absolutely nothing to do with any possible external influence from the sun...???

Lord Foul wrote:and

for the long term effect


The northern lights are shifting south from the Arctic, and will appear more often in the skies over Ottawa in decades to come, a new study says.

The reason: Earth’s magnetic field is becoming gradually weaker, and this affects how the solar wind — charged particles from the sun — bounces off it.

In time, the aurora could reach as far as the southern United States.

“The Earth’s magnetic field more or less keeps the solar wind at bay, and it’s the solar wind interacting with the field that contributes to the auroras,” said Dennis Kent, an expert in paleomagnetism at Columbia University’s Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory.

“With a strong field, that interaction is pushed to high latitudes. With a weaker field more of the Earth is bathed in these charged particles.

“So a consequence would be that the aurora would be visible at lower latitudes.” The same is expected with the southern lights.

Kent does not count on living long enough to see the changes, “but I expect my grandson will. He’s six.”

And even today’s adults may see some progression, such as brighter or more common displays of the aurora in places like Ottawa, where it is already visible from time to time.

Kent is a co-author of a paper just published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS), a major research journal.

The paper looks at how Earth’s magnetic field is weakening, and suggests it has been abnormally high but is now retreating toward the long-term average. The field has weakened by about 10 per cent in the past two centuries.

But there’s a more important reason to study this, beyond knowing when the sky will be pretty. The magnetic field occasionally “flips” and reverses our planet’s north and south poles.

It has done this hundreds of times in the past 100 million years, most recently about 780,000 years ago. During the current weakening, some scientists have been expecting it to become unstable and flip again.

That’s unlikely for now, Kent’s team says. They estimate that the current field, despite weakening, is still stronger than the long-term average, leaving plenty of room for change without becoming unstable.

Earth scientists can chart past changes by looking at volcanic rock. As lava cools, iron-bearing minerals in it solidify and act like tiny magnets, aligning with the Earth’s magnetic field. By knowing the age of the rock, a scientist can determine which way the magnetic field was oriented and how strong it was when the rock formed, and how strong the magnetic field was.
from http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-not-so-northern-lights-aurora-moving-south-from-the-arctic-study-shows


so Tommy, nothing AT ALL to do with more output from the sun

magnetic field decreasing

In fact Tommy


read this...cant copy it they have their guard dog on patrol

http://phys.org/news/2015-08-solar-decliningwhat.html

erm the earths magnetic field exists independantly of the sun you cabbage

I have not denied the current/regular shifting of magnetic poles, or the possibility of a total flipping of north/south... in fact it is something I have posted about before...


I just wanted you to confirm your belief in this... and then to answer my second question...




Secondly, can you provide any conclusive evidence explaining why (if at all) this would be happening... and how this would be absolutely nothing to do with any possible external influence from the sun...???

Lord Foul wrote:erm the earths magnetic field exists independantly of the sun you cabbage

You complete bellend!!!

The earth magnetic field is constantly being directly influenced by the sun!!!




http://www.space.com/22393-sun-magnetic-field-explained-infographic.html


https://www.nasa.gov/content/goddard/the-suns-magnetic-field-is-about-to-flip/





Stick to standing down your two short planks victor... leave the clever stuff for us "sparky's" to think about...!!!


Most amusing!!!


:

Tommy I imagine you as the guy in blue

you bellend Tommy those two articles are about the SUNS magnetic field, and neither of them make any reference to it having an effect on the earths field.

this is your trouble....you read something and only THINK you understand it...in fact you dont, as you have prved repeatedly over the years

you are so stupid....you dont know you are stupid


dont tell me you are a "domestic " sparky

fractal stupid in fact....

recursive dumbness


oh gawd......

hey tommy...dont forget

red to red
black to black

connect together and stand well back

well ok so now its brown and blue, but that dont rhyme too well

Lord Foul wrote:fractal stupid in fact....

recursive dumbness


oh gawd......

hey tommy...dont forget

red to red
black to black

connect together and stand well back

well ok so now its brown and blue, but that dont rhyme too well

Always wear wellies.

The electro magnetic power of the sun is huge and directly affects our planets own magnetic field!!!


It also spreads through our solar system... as it says in one of the links I gave!!!


I'll try to explain in simple terms for you... remember when you were a kid and you learned how that rubbing a magnet along a needle a few times put magnetism into the needle and it could then be used as a compass etc...?


Well basically... our planet is like a needle and the sun is like a big magnet, rubbing us with its force!!!


Sheesh... next you'll be trying to tell a surgeon how to do operations...!!!

go rub your willy tommy you total plonker...

the earth generates ITS OWN field

The magnetic field that the earth holds/displays is the result of induction from the sun... both from the original beginnings of the formation of the earth, throughout the whole history of the earth, and now!!!

rubbish

Although the Earth's magnetic field resembles that of a bar magnet we must find another explanation for the field's origin. Permanent magnets cannot exist at the temperatures found in the Earth's core. We also know that the Earth has had a magnetic field for hundreds of millions of years. We cannot, however, simply attribute the existence of the present geomagnetic field to some event in the distant past. Magnetic fields decay, and we can show that the existing geomagnetic field would disappear in about 15,000 years unless there were a mechanism to continually regenerate it.

Many mechanisms have been postulated to explain how the magnetic field is generated, but the only one that is now considered plausible is analogous to a dynamo, or generator - a devise for converting mechanical energy to electrical energy. To understand how a dynamo would work in the context of the Earth, we need to understand the physical conditions in the Earth's interior.

The Earth is composed of layers: a thin outer crust, a silicate mantle, an outer core and an inner core. Both temperature and pressure increase with depth within the Earth. The temperature at the core mantle boundary is roughly 4800° C, hot enough for the outer core to exist in a liquid state. The inner core, however, is solid because of increased pressure. The core is composed primarily of iron, with a small percentage of lighter elements. The outer core is in constant motion, due both to the Earth's rotation and to convection. The convection is driven by the upward motion of the light elements as the heavier elements freeze onto the inner core.
Earth's interior

Earth's interior

The actual process by which the magnetic field is produced in this environment is extremely complex, and many of the parameters required for a complete solution of the mathematical equations describing the problem are poorly known. However, the basic concepts are not difficult. For magnetic field generation to occur several conditions must be met:

there must be a conducting fluid;
there must be enough energy to cause the fluid to move with sufficient speed and with the appropriate flow pattern;
there must be a "seed" magnetic field.

All these conditions are met in the outer core. Molten iron is a good conductor. There is sufficient energy to drive convection, and the convective motion, coupled with the Earth's rotation, produce the appropriate flow pattern. Even before the Earth's magnetic field was first formed magnetic fields were present in the form of the sun's magnetic field. Once the process is going, the existing field acts as the seed field. As a stream of molten iron passes through the existing magnetic field, an electric current is generated through a process called magnetic induction. The newly created electric field will in turn create a magnetic field. Given the right relationship between the magnetic field and the fluid flow, the generated magnetic field can reinforces the initial magnetic field. As long as there is sufficient fluid motion in the outer core, the process will continue.


SO although the suns field may have , millions upon millions of yars ago acted as the "seed field" it is NO LONGER relevant to our magnetic field, indeed it opposes it (go on think about it)

the earths magnetic field is many times stronger than what could be "induced" by the sun....

First you say 'rubbish'... then you admit I was right, but while still saying I'm wrong!!!???










http://ibex.swri.edu/students/How_does_the_Sun.shtml