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About Us & RulesPalestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
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Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:40 pm
First topic message reminder :
That we notice there’s a war on only when Jews are murdered does not cancel out the fact that Palestinians are being killed all the time.
Yes, this is a war, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, with his mandate from the people, has ordered its intensification. He does not listen to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas’ messages of conciliation and acceptance in calmer times, why should he listen to them now?
Netanyahu is intensifying the war mainly in East Jerusalem, with orgies of collective punishment. He thus further reveals Israel’s success in physically disconnecting Jerusalem from most of the Palestinian population, accenting the absence of Palestinian leadership in East Jerusalem and the weakness of the government in Ramallah — which is trying to stop the drift in the rest of the West Bank.
The war did not start last Thursday, it does not start with the Jewish victims and does not end when no Jews are murdered. The Palestinians are fighting for their life, in the full sense of the word. We Israeli Jews are fighting for our privilege as a nation of masters, in the full ugliness of the term.
That we notice there’s a war on only when Jews are murdered does not cancel out the fact that Palestinians are being killed all the time, and that all the time we are doing everything in our power to make their lives unbearable. Most of the time it is a unilateral war, waged by us, to get them to say “yes” to the master, thank you very much for keeping us alive in our reservations. When something in the war’s one-sidedness is disturbed, and Jews are murdered, then we pay attention.
Young Palestinians do not go out to murder Jews because they are Jews, but because we are their occupiers, their torturers, their jailers, the thieves of their land and water, their exilers, the demolishers of their homes, the blockers of their horizon. Young Palestinians, vengeful and desperate, are willing to lose their lives and cause their families great pain because the enemy they face proves every day that its malice has no limits.
Even the language is malicious. Jews are murdered, Palestinians are killed and die. Is that so? The problem doesn’t begin with our not being permitted to write that a soldier or police officer murdered Palestinians, at close range, when his life was not in danger, or by remote control or from a plane or a drone. But it is part of the problem. Our comprehension is captive to a retroactively censored language that distorts reality. In our language, Jews are murdered because they are Jews and Palestinians find their death and their distress, because presumably that’s what they’re looking for.
Our worldview is shaped by the consistent betrayal by Israeli media outlets of their duty to report events, or their lack of the technical and the emotional ability to contain all of the details of the world war that we are conducting in order to preserve our superiority in the land between the river and the sea.
Not even this newspaper has the economic resources to employ 10 reporters and fill 20 pages with reports on all the attacks in times of escalation and all the attacks of the occupation in times of calm, from shooting through building a road that destroys a village to legalizing a settlement outpost and a million more assaults. Every day. The random examples we do manage to report are but a drop in the ocean, and they have no impact on the comprehension of the situation for a large majority of Israelis.
The goal of this unilateral war is to force the Palestinians to give up all their national demands in their homeland. Netanyahu wants escalation because experience so far has proved that the periods of calm after the bleeding return us not to the starting line, but rather to a new low in the Palestinian political system, and adds privileges to the Jews in Greater Israel.
Privileges are the chief factor that distorts our understanding of our reality, blinding us. Because of them, we fail to comprehend that even with weak, “present-absent” leadership, the Palestinian people — scattered in its Indian reservations — will not give up and will continue to find the strength necessary to resist our malicious mastership.
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.679129
Haaretz - an ISRAELI paper.
That we notice there’s a war on only when Jews are murdered does not cancel out the fact that Palestinians are being killed all the time.
Yes, this is a war, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, with his mandate from the people, has ordered its intensification. He does not listen to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas’ messages of conciliation and acceptance in calmer times, why should he listen to them now?
Netanyahu is intensifying the war mainly in East Jerusalem, with orgies of collective punishment. He thus further reveals Israel’s success in physically disconnecting Jerusalem from most of the Palestinian population, accenting the absence of Palestinian leadership in East Jerusalem and the weakness of the government in Ramallah — which is trying to stop the drift in the rest of the West Bank.
The war did not start last Thursday, it does not start with the Jewish victims and does not end when no Jews are murdered. The Palestinians are fighting for their life, in the full sense of the word. We Israeli Jews are fighting for our privilege as a nation of masters, in the full ugliness of the term.
That we notice there’s a war on only when Jews are murdered does not cancel out the fact that Palestinians are being killed all the time, and that all the time we are doing everything in our power to make their lives unbearable. Most of the time it is a unilateral war, waged by us, to get them to say “yes” to the master, thank you very much for keeping us alive in our reservations. When something in the war’s one-sidedness is disturbed, and Jews are murdered, then we pay attention.
Young Palestinians do not go out to murder Jews because they are Jews, but because we are their occupiers, their torturers, their jailers, the thieves of their land and water, their exilers, the demolishers of their homes, the blockers of their horizon. Young Palestinians, vengeful and desperate, are willing to lose their lives and cause their families great pain because the enemy they face proves every day that its malice has no limits.
Even the language is malicious. Jews are murdered, Palestinians are killed and die. Is that so? The problem doesn’t begin with our not being permitted to write that a soldier or police officer murdered Palestinians, at close range, when his life was not in danger, or by remote control or from a plane or a drone. But it is part of the problem. Our comprehension is captive to a retroactively censored language that distorts reality. In our language, Jews are murdered because they are Jews and Palestinians find their death and their distress, because presumably that’s what they’re looking for.
Our worldview is shaped by the consistent betrayal by Israeli media outlets of their duty to report events, or their lack of the technical and the emotional ability to contain all of the details of the world war that we are conducting in order to preserve our superiority in the land between the river and the sea.
Not even this newspaper has the economic resources to employ 10 reporters and fill 20 pages with reports on all the attacks in times of escalation and all the attacks of the occupation in times of calm, from shooting through building a road that destroys a village to legalizing a settlement outpost and a million more assaults. Every day. The random examples we do manage to report are but a drop in the ocean, and they have no impact on the comprehension of the situation for a large majority of Israelis.
The goal of this unilateral war is to force the Palestinians to give up all their national demands in their homeland. Netanyahu wants escalation because experience so far has proved that the periods of calm after the bleeding return us not to the starting line, but rather to a new low in the Palestinian political system, and adds privileges to the Jews in Greater Israel.
Privileges are the chief factor that distorts our understanding of our reality, blinding us. Because of them, we fail to comprehend that even with weak, “present-absent” leadership, the Palestinian people — scattered in its Indian reservations — will not give up and will continue to find the strength necessary to resist our malicious mastership.
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.679129
Haaretz - an ISRAELI paper.
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Irn Bru Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:14 am
Just to add Didge. Your comparison with the King David Hotel being blown up was also flawed.
That act of terrorism was carried out by the Irgun Gang led by Menachem Begin who wasn't even born in Palestine or Israel if you want to call it that just like most of the gang were.
He went on to become prime minister of Israel so terrorism works for some people and he is hailed as a hero whilst others are branded as just............well terrorists.
Strange eh?
That act of terrorism was carried out by the Irgun Gang led by Menachem Begin who wasn't even born in Palestine or Israel if you want to call it that just like most of the gang were.
He went on to become prime minister of Israel so terrorism works for some people and he is hailed as a hero whilst others are branded as just............well terrorists.
Strange eh?
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
- Posts : 7719
Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:16 am
Ok, officially had enough of reading a coward and a Quisling trying to justify being a coward and a Quisling.
Night Irn, Johnboy was going to bed ages ago but obviously can't stand for the truth to be told.
However many words he uses, however much he deflects, he's a coward and a Quisling. Nothing else to say really.
Night Irn, Johnboy was going to bed ages ago but obviously can't stand for the truth to be told.
However many words he uses, however much he deflects, he's a coward and a Quisling. Nothing else to say really.
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Irn Bru Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:19 am
Cuchulain wrote:All irrelevant Irn.
Her method was to fight or be a Quisling, froma view off being occupied.
Fight allows for many forms of ressiatnce.
So I do not have to even factor countless other methods, when the point is to show how bad such a method is that would then justifying many wrongs and groups in history for some of their acts.
Clearly you are admitting to this and why there is no need to show other forms of ressiatnce with fighting,
So again you make irrlevant points to a flawed view point she had.
The point is to show the method is flawed.
You do understand why the views were made on showing how and why its flawed.
So I never went wrong and as seen sassy's method allows for the justification for many wrongs.
So this is what I mean Irn, more deflections from you.
I am bored now to be honest as this is text book deflections from you both.
No Didge. Yoiu are trying to turn the question into something it wasn't based on your belief that 'fight' only meant armed resistance and it was that belief that led you to make the comparisons that you did.
It's really simple to understand that.......surely
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
- Posts : 7719
Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:22 am
It does not matter where a person is born Irn
Here even more if they are ethnically Jewish
You are now saying they were not citizens of the British Mandate?
So what you are bascially saying is that they had no rights as people residing there along with many other foreign born people
So again you are in error
You are basically saying all foreign born people to the Uk of which many are citizens, are then not part of a nation?
The British occupied the lands called the British Mandate, which is then covered by sassys method of occupation.
You see how flawed her view is?
There is no justification for such terrorist attacks, but as seen her method allows for this and even the King David Hotel attack.
The area was occupied by the British
It is then under occupation by a foreign power.
Here even more if they are ethnically Jewish
You are now saying they were not citizens of the British Mandate?
So what you are bascially saying is that they had no rights as people residing there along with many other foreign born people
So again you are in error
You are basically saying all foreign born people to the Uk of which many are citizens, are then not part of a nation?
The British occupied the lands called the British Mandate, which is then covered by sassys method of occupation.
You see how flawed her view is?
There is no justification for such terrorist attacks, but as seen her method allows for this and even the King David Hotel attack.
The area was occupied by the British
It is then under occupation by a foreign power.
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:26 am
Irn Bru wrote:Cuchulain wrote:All irrelevant Irn.
Her method was to fight or be a Quisling, froma view off being occupied.
Fight allows for many forms of ressiatnce.
So I do not have to even factor countless other methods, when the point is to show how bad such a method is that would then justifying many wrongs and groups in history for some of their acts.
Clearly you are admitting to this and why there is no need to show other forms of ressiatnce with fighting,
So again you make irrlevant points to a flawed view point she had.
The point is to show the method is flawed.
You do understand why the views were made on showing how and why its flawed.
So I never went wrong and as seen sassy's method allows for the justification for many wrongs.
So this is what I mean Irn, more deflections from you.
I am bored now to be honest as this is text book deflections from you both.
No Didge. Yoiu are trying to turn the question into something it wasn't based on your belief that 'fight' only meant armed resistance and it was that belief that led you to make the comparisons that you did.
It's really simple to understand that.......surely
No Irn, her method as seen was flawed,
The view to fight can allow for all forms of resistance
If you cannot rule them out, her method is flawed
Its a method, do you understand methoids?
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Irn Bru Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:37 am
Cuchulain wrote:It does not matter where a person is born Irn
Here even more if they are ethnically Jewish
You are now saying they were not citizens of the British Mandate?
So what you are bascially saying is that they had no rights as people residing there along with many other foreign born people
So again you are in error
You are basically saying all foreign born people to the Uk of which many are citizens, are then not part of a nation?
The British occupied the lands called the British Mandate, which is then covered by sassys method of occupation.
You see how flawed her view is?
There is no justification for such terrorist attacks, but as seen her method allows for this and even the King David Hotel attack.
The area was occupied by the British
It is then under occupation by a foreign power.
Yes of course they had rights but the rights bestowed to them were never to the extent that they can blow up innocent people. As immigrants they should have accepted that.
You have wtitten countless words on here trying to make out that someone was trying to justify terrorism as a means to an end and that that person was supporting terrorism as the only means to achieve that. That's the comparisonsthat you made which was why it was flawed from the start.
It was shameful and disgusting and nothing more than a personal attack and an attempt to try and demonize someone whilst whitewashing away all the crimes committed by the very people that you have consistently supported throughout all these discussions about Palestine.
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
- Posts : 7719
Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Irn Bru Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:39 am
Cuchulain wrote:Irn Bru wrote:Cuchulain wrote:All irrelevant Irn.
Her method was to fight or be a Quisling, froma view off being occupied.
Fight allows for many forms of ressiatnce.
So I do not have to even factor countless other methods, when the point is to show how bad such a method is that would then justifying many wrongs and groups in history for some of their acts.
Clearly you are admitting to this and why there is no need to show other forms of ressiatnce with fighting,
So again you make irrlevant points to a flawed view point she had.
The point is to show the method is flawed.
You do understand why the views were made on showing how and why its flawed.
So I never went wrong and as seen sassy's method allows for the justification for many wrongs.
So this is what I mean Irn, more deflections from you.
I am bored now to be honest as this is text book deflections from you both.
No Didge. Yoiu are trying to turn the question into something it wasn't based on your belief that 'fight' only meant armed resistance and it was that belief that led you to make the comparisons that you did.
It's really simple to understand that.......surely
No Irn, her method as seen was flawed,
The view to fight can allow for all forms of resistance
If you cannot rule them out, her method is flawed
Its a method, do you understand methoids?
Yes Didge and the part highlighted above is what you didn't consider which is why your argument was flawed
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
- Posts : 7719
Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Irn Bru Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:43 am
Anyway. Time for bed. Catch you tomorrow when I'm sure you will realise how you got it so wrong.
Night
Night
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
- Posts : 7719
Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:45 am
Irn Bru wrote:Cuchulain wrote:It does not matter where a person is born Irn
Here even more if they are ethnically Jewish
You are now saying they were not citizens of the British Mandate?
So what you are bascially saying is that they had no rights as people residing there along with many other foreign born people
So again you are in error
You are basically saying all foreign born people to the Uk of which many are citizens, are then not part of a nation?
The British occupied the lands called the British Mandate, which is then covered by sassys method of occupation.
You see how flawed her view is?
There is no justification for such terrorist attacks, but as seen her method allows for this and even the King David Hotel attack.
The area was occupied by the British
It is then under occupation by a foreign power.
Yes of course they had rights but the rights bestowed to them were never to the extent that they can blow up innocent people. As immigrants they should have accepted that.
Again irrelevant to the sassy method.
They were living in these lands. The British were in occupation. They were then living in a land that was occupied by the British.
If a foreign power is occupying, then by Sassy's method, this would justify their actions.
You see many Palestinians who do not live in Israel or were born in Israel view this land as occupied. So your point is moot
What is relevant is if the land is occupied by a foreign force.
Now the British were certainly occupying the land there.
You have wtitten countless words on here trying to make out that someone was trying to justify terrorism as a means to an end and that that person was supporting terrorism as the only means to achieve that. That's the comparisonsthat you made which was why it was flawed from the start.
She did by her method justify countless terrorist attacks, where the view to fight based on occupation. As if you do not fight you are then Quislings in her method. She is then saying that the method is to resist under occupation. Now you tell me how many of these terrorists are actually honoured Irn by both sides? Where they are certainly not seen as Quislings? Rember when a person makes a method on a question. It can as seen be applied to countless wrongs committed.
So no point denying this and why I made a big point on this to show how flawed it is.
It was shameful and disgusting and nothing more than a personal attack and an attempt to try and demonize someone whilst whitewashing away all the crimes committed by the very people that you have consistently supported throughout all these discussions about Palestine.
More deflections
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:50 am
Irn Bru wrote:Anyway. Time for bed. Catch you tomorrow when I'm sure you will realise how you got it so wrong.
Night
You are entittled to your views Irn.
I have reasoned my points
Night all the besr
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
by Guest Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:53 am
Irn Bru wrote:Cuchulain wrote:
No Irn, her method as seen was flawed,
The view to fight can allow for all forms of resistance
If you cannot rule them out, her method is flawed
Its a method, do you understand methoids?
Yes Didge and the part highlighted above is what you didn't consider which is why your argument was flawed
Again irrelevant when the point is to show the method flawed.
I have proved this, as her method by stating fight under a view of occupation
So you are deflecting badly again, as are you able to rule out violent ressiatnce based on the view to fight under occupation?
No
As fighting is allowed by her method based off occupation.
Are you saying violence is not a form of fighting?
Of course not, hence why you are deflecting
Night
Guest- Guest
Re: Palestinians Are Fighting for Their Lives; Israel Is Fighting for the Occupation
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