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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Original Quill Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:05 am

German magazine reveals documents showing how ‘Haji Bakr’ created efficient management that helped ISIL succeed
April 20, 2015 11:04AM ET

A former intelligence officer for the late Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein was the mastermind behind ISIL’s takeover of northern Syria, according to a report by Der Spiegel that is based on documents uncovered by the German magazine.

Der Spiegel, in a long story published over the weekend, "Secret files reveal the structure of Islamic State,” said it gained access to 31 pages of handwritten charts, lists and schedules that amount to a blueprint for the establishment of a caliphate in Syria, which the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) has declared it has set up.

The documents were the work of a man identified by the magazine as Samir Abd Muhammad al-Khlifawi, an Iraqi national and a former colonel in the intelligence service of Saddam's air defense force. Khlifawi went by the pseudonym Haji Bakr.

Der Spiegel said the files suggest that the takeover of northern Syria was part of a meticulous plan overseen by Khlifawi using techniques — including surveillance, espionage, murder and kidnapping — honed in Saddam's security apparatus.

Khlifawi was reportedly killed in a firefight with Syrian rebels in January 2014, but not before he had helped ISIL secure swaths of Syria, which in turn strengthened ISIL’s position in neighboring Iraq.

"What Bakr put on paper, page by page, with carefully outlined boxes for individual responsibilities, was nothing less than a blueprint for a takeover," the story by Der Spiegel reporter Christoph Reuter said.

"It was not a manifesto of faith, but a technically precise plan for an 'Islamic Intelligence State' — a caliphate run by an organization that resembled East Germany's notorious Stasi domestic intelligence agency."

The story describes Khlifawi as being "bitter and unemployed" after U.S. authorities in Iraq disbanded the army by decree in 2003. From 2006 to 2008 he was reportedly in U.S. detention facilities, including Abu Ghraib prison.

In 2010, Khlifawi and a small group of former Iraqi intelligence officers made the devout Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi the official leader of ISIL, with the goal of giving the group a "religious face,” the story says.

Two years later, the magazine says, Khlifawi traveled to northern Syria to oversee his takeover plan, choosing to launch it with a collection of foreigners including novice fighters from Saudi Arabia, Tunisia and Europe alongside battle-tested Chechens and Uzbeks.

Iraqi journalist Hisham al-Hashimi, whose cousin was in ISIL with Khlifawi, describes the former officer as a nationalist rather than someone whose main motivation was religious. The story argues that the secret to ISIL’s success lies in its combination of opposites — the fanatical beliefs of one part and the strategic calculations of another, led by Khlifawi.

Der Spiegel said it obtained the papers after lengthy negotiations with rebels in the Syrian city of Aleppo who seized them when ISIL was forced to abandon its headquarters there in early 2014.

The Soufan Group, a risk consultancy that closely monitors ISIL, said in an assessment of the group in June that it was Khlifawi who nominated Baghdadi, the current leader of ISIL, as the caliph of the organization.

With the instrumental help of Khlifawi, the foundations for ISIL as an organization with effective management abilities were laid. In a report last fall on the group’s structure, the Bloomberg news agency said in the group’s operation was “more akin to General Motors that to a religious dynasty.”

Al Jazeera and Reuters

What did I tell you??  ISIL is the old Baathist Party regime, in new clothes.  ISIL is the former Al Qaeda in Iraq, formerly Saddam's old cronies.  The more things change, the more they stay the same.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:11 am

No that does not show that in any shape or form.
One former Colonel of intelligence is not showing the ideology behind ISIS at all and is showing little understanding of their ideology or how greivances have formed from the Shia run Governement.

All this person did or was even recruited to the cause helped them with military skill conquer and organise themselves as an effective force.

You need to understand the difference here and I have no doubt for members of the Baathist party would be disgruntled over Shia control being as they persecuted them and buthcered many for example in 1991 in the uprising. Everything is not as you are putting into simplistic reasons that fall very short of understanding here.
Religion is the root cause and centuries of Shia and Sunni hatred.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Original Quill Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:39 pm

Nemesis wrote:No that does not show that in any shape or form.
One former Colonel of intelligence is not showing the ideology behind ISIS at all and is showing little understanding of their ideology or how greivances have formed from the Shia run Governement.

All this person did or was even recruited to the cause helped them with military skill conquer and organise themselves as an effective force.

You need to understand the difference here and I have no doubt for members of the Baathist party would be disgruntled over Shia control being as they persecuted them and buthcered many for example in 1991 in the uprising. Everything is not as you are putting into simplistic reasons that fall very short of understanding here.
Religion is the root cause and centuries of Shia and Sunni hatred.

Yet, he was the basis of ISIL.  Now, to deny him is to deny ISIL...or, that is to say, deny ISIL as a leading component of radical Islam.  It is Baathist, and even in Saddam's day that was not the whole picture.

Right now, I tend to agree with you--that ISIL is a minor bother in the grander scheme of things.  The real emphasis of the west should be the Shi'ia/Sunni split.  Look what Iran is doing in the southern Arabian peninsula:

Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Fc6be7e4-6e72-4493-a7af-402142aae652-620x372

Fox News wrote:
US aircraft carrier sent to block Iranian arms shipments to Yemen rebels

A U.S. aircraft carrier was dispatched to the waters off Yemen Monday to join other American ships prepared to block any Iranian weapons shipments to Shiite Houthi rebels fighting in Yemen.

A Navy official confirmed to Fox News that the USS Theodore Roosevelt -- along with her escort ship, the USS Normandy, a guided-missile cruiser -- left the Persian Gulf on Sunday en route for the Arabian Sea, to help enforce the blockade. A massive ship that carries F/A-18 fighter jets, the Roosevelt is seen more of a deterrent and show of force in the region.

The U.S. Navy has been beefing up its presence in the Gulf of Aden and the southern Arabian Sea amid reports that a convoy of about eight Iranian ships is heading toward Yemen and possibly carrying arms for the Houthis.

The deployment comes after a U.N. Security Council resolution approved last week imposed an arms embargo on rebel leaders. The resolution passed in a 14-0 vote with Russia abstaining.

Tensions are rising in the region even as the U.S. and five other world powers scramble to strike a final deal with Iran on its nuclear program by the end of June. The fighting in Yemen, where U.S. ally Saudi Arabia is leading a coalition of mainly Gulf Arab countries against the Iran-backed rebels, is complicating matters.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:42 pm

Sorry but that is a load of complete rubbish in every shape or form and would like be saying Nazism was down to only Hitler.

In every aspect you have take one person and viewed where this group is an extreme version of wahhabism and follows its doctrine to the letter to be the reason behind its creation. Again nonsense and rubbish

ISIS even carries out this doctrine to the letter.

All he did was devise their succcess, and he is not even their leader.

Even your own article makes no such distinctiion, and only you do.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:45 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Nemesis wrote:No that does not show that in any shape or form.
One former Colonel of intelligence is not showing the ideology behind ISIS at all and is showing little understanding of their ideology or how greivances have formed from the Shia run Governement.

All this person did or was even recruited to the cause helped them with military skill conquer and organise themselves as an effective force.

You need to understand the difference here and I have no doubt for members of the Baathist party would be disgruntled over Shia control being as they persecuted them and buthcered many for example in 1991 in the uprising. Everything is not as you are putting into simplistic reasons that fall very short of understanding here.
Religion is the root cause and centuries of Shia and Sunni hatred.

Yet, he was the basis of ISIL.  Now, to deny him is to deny ISIL...or, that is to say, deny ISIL as a leading component of radical Islam.  It is Baathist, and even in Saddam's day that was not the whole picture.

Right now, I tend to agree with you--that ISIL is a minor bother in the grander scheme of things.  The real emphasis of the west should be the Shi'ia/Sunni split.  Look what Iran is doing in the southern Arabian peninsula:

Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Fc6be7e4-6e72-4493-a7af-402142aae652-620x372

Fox News wrote:
US aircraft carrier sent to block Iranian arms shipments to Yemen rebels

A U.S. aircraft carrier was dispatched to the waters off Yemen Monday to join other American ships prepared to block any Iranian weapons shipments to Shiite Houthi rebels fighting in Yemen.

A Navy official confirmed to Fox News that the USS Theodore Roosevelt -- along with her escort ship, the USS Normandy, a guided-missile cruiser -- left the Persian Gulf on Sunday en route for the Arabian Sea, to help enforce the blockade. A massive ship that carries F/A-18 fighter jets, the Roosevelt is seen more of a deterrent and show of force in the region.

The U.S. Navy has been beefing up its presence in the Gulf of Aden and the southern Arabian Sea amid reports that a convoy of about eight Iranian ships is heading toward Yemen and possibly carrying arms for the Houthis.

The deployment comes after a U.N. Security Council resolution approved last week imposed an arms embargo on rebel leaders. The resolution passed in a 14-0 vote with Russia abstaining.

Tensions are rising in the region even as the U.S. and five other world powers scramble to strike a final deal with Iran on its nuclear program by the end of June. The fighting in Yemen, where U.S. ally Saudi Arabia is leading a coalition of mainly Gulf Arab countries against the Iran-backed rebels, is complicating matters.


Good afternoon Quill.

I hope you are in a patient mood today because poor old Nemesis is spouting out all sorts of guff.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Original Quill Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:47 pm

Nemesis wrote:Sorry but that is a load of complete rubbish in every shape or form and would like be saying Nazism was down to only Hitler.

In every aspect you have take one person and viewed where this group is an extreme version of wahhabism and follows its doctrine to the letter to be the reason behind its creation. Again nonsense and rubbish

ISIS even carries out this doctrine to the letter.

All he did was devise their succcess, and he is not even their leader.

Even your own article makes no such distinctiion, and only you do.

Yes, he was only third in command of the Baathists, but your marginalization of him shows only that ISIL is not that great a threat.

ISIL is only the residual of what was left over from Iraq. Despite it's grand schemes, it is only a minor front in the theater-wide scope of things. Watch Iran...that's where things are going to happen.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Original Quill Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:49 pm

Shady wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Yet, he was the basis of ISIL.  Now, to deny him is to deny ISIL...or, that is to say, deny ISIL as a leading component of radical Islam.  It is Baathist, and even in Saddam's day that was not the whole picture.

Right now, I tend to agree with you--that ISIL is a minor bother in the grander scheme of things.  The real emphasis of the west should be the Shi'ia/Sunni split.  Look what Iran is doing in the southern Arabian peninsula:

Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Fc6be7e4-6e72-4493-a7af-402142aae652-620x372




Good afternoon Quill.

I hope you are in a patient mood today because poor old Nemesis is spouting out all sorts of guff.

Hello Shady...good to see you again, my friend. Hope you are doing well.

Yes, I have already been visited by didge. I am trying to settle him down by use of reason.

Good luck! Lol

Original Quill
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Posts : 37540
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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:50 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Nemesis wrote:Sorry but that is a load of complete rubbish in every shape or form and would like be saying Nazism was down to only Hitler.

In every aspect you have take one person and viewed where this group is an extreme version of wahhabism and follows its doctrine to the letter to be the reason behind its creation. Again nonsense and rubbish

ISIS even carries out this doctrine to the letter.

All he did was devise their succcess, and he is not even their leader.

Even your own article makes no such distinctiion, and only you do.

Yes, he was only third in command of the Baathists, but your marginalization of him shows only that ISIL is not that great a threat.

ISIL is only the residual of what was left over from Iraq.  Despite it's grand schemes, it is only a minor front in the theater-wide scope of things.  Watch Iran...that's where things are going to happen.

ISIS are a great threat being as what they have accomplished so far with the forces they have so again that is a mistke on your part to underestimate their forces.


No ISIS is the like all the other major extremist groups like AlQaeda, the taliban the ideologies of Wahabbism.

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:51 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Nemesis wrote:No that does not show that in any shape or form.
One former Colonel of intelligence is not showing the ideology behind ISIS at all and is showing little understanding of their ideology or how greivances have formed from the Shia run Governement.

All this person did or was even recruited to the cause helped them with military skill conquer and organise themselves as an effective force.

You need to understand the difference here and I have no doubt for members of the Baathist party would be disgruntled over Shia control being as they persecuted them and buthcered many for example in 1991 in the uprising. Everything is not as you are putting into simplistic reasons that fall very short of understanding here.
Religion is the root cause and centuries of Shia and Sunni hatred.

Yet, he was the basis of ISIL.  Now, to deny him is to deny ISIL...or, that is to say, deny ISIL as a leading component of radical Islam.  It is Baathist, and even in Saddam's day that was not the whole picture.

Right now, I tend to agree with you--that ISIL is a minor bother in the grander scheme of things.  The real emphasis of the west should be the Shi'ia/Sunni split.  Look what Iran is doing in the southern Arabian peninsula:

Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Fc6be7e4-6e72-4493-a7af-402142aae652-620x372

Fox News wrote:
US aircraft carrier sent to block Iranian arms shipments to Yemen rebels

A U.S. aircraft carrier was dispatched to the waters off Yemen Monday to join other American ships prepared to block any Iranian weapons shipments to Shiite Houthi rebels fighting in Yemen.

A Navy official confirmed to Fox News that the USS Theodore Roosevelt -- along with her escort ship, the USS Normandy, a guided-missile cruiser -- left the Persian Gulf on Sunday en route for the Arabian Sea, to help enforce the blockade. A massive ship that carries F/A-18 fighter jets, the Roosevelt is seen more of a deterrent and show of force in the region.

The U.S. Navy has been beefing up its presence in the Gulf of Aden and the southern Arabian Sea amid reports that a convoy of about eight Iranian ships is heading toward Yemen and possibly carrying arms for the Houthis.

The deployment comes after a U.N. Security Council resolution approved last week imposed an arms embargo on rebel leaders. The resolution passed in a 14-0 vote with Russia abstaining.

Tensions are rising in the region even as the U.S. and five other world powers scramble to strike a final deal with Iran on its nuclear program by the end of June. The fighting in Yemen, where U.S. ally Saudi Arabia is leading a coalition of mainly Gulf Arab countries against the Iran-backed rebels, is complicating matters.

HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR!!

Quill that's brilliant and you are such a naughty so & so....You've surreptitiously introduced a picture of an aircraft carrier into the conversation knowing that is what sent Nemesis over the edge last time.

GOD!! I LOVE YOU QUILL!!

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:52 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Shady wrote:


Good afternoon Quill.

I hope you are in a patient mood today because poor old Nemesis is spouting out all sorts of guff.

Hello Shady...good to see you again, my friend.  Hope you are doing well.

Yes, I have already been visited by didge.  I am trying to settle him down by use of reason.

Good luck!  Lol

Its Nemesis and if you do not see that sady is a trolll then you really are naive.
If you cannot see his intent and the fact he is using you to stir further, then I really pity you then Quill

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Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise Empty Re: Documents show Saddam-era Iraqi officer masterminded ISIL’s rise

Post by Guest Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:58 pm

Oh well, will come back later when the troll has settled down for his medication and has been locked up in his cell for the night..


Back later.

Laughing

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