Grace Dent: Is this what Ukip thinks we secretly think? That Lenny Henry should go and live in a ‘black country’? It’s time to fight back

The fact that the comedian Lenny Henry is a British man born in Dudley, close to Birmingham, seems – to me at least – something as deep-rooted in the British conscience as other, similar doofus-grade Who Wants To Be a Millionaire questions such as: “Where is the Queen’s Scottish residence?” or “Which country did Paddington Bear come from the deepest, darkest part of?”
It’s impossible as a British person to say how one originally found these things out. One just knows. Still, the fact of Lenny Henry’s country of birth has eluded the Ukip candidate for Enfield, William Henwood, who suggested over the weekend that Lenny Henry should “emigrate to a black country”, if he’s not happy living with “whites”.

Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.” He is unapologetic and indignant at the fuss. Keeping in mind that Ukip seems to be gaining considerable popularity in this country for being those ruddy great blokes with the brass balls to say what we’re all secretly thinking, it is useful to know what they secretly think we all think.

A recent episode of Channel 4’s Gogglebox – the programme that watches the everyday man watching telly – showed almost every sofa being won over by Farage’s “Tell it as you see it” chutzpah. Presumably, the trickle-down effect of this is buffoons like Henwood treating us to the full majesty of their “everyman” grunts before spinning round with a confident, “Am I right, guys?” For the good of Great Britain we need to keep whacking these prats back into place, like a depressing game of beach-front whack-a-mole, with the vehement shout of, “No, pillock, you’re absolutely wrong.”

The most galling part of Henwood’s musings is that it was in response to an erudite Bafta speech by Lenny Henry about the time-worn British theatrical and televisual problem of representation for non-white actors. Clearly, this discrepancy – the historical and socio-political reasons for it plus the debate of how to rectify the problem – is a topic which could fill many thousands of words. But in its briefest form, there’s a reason that fine British actors like Idris Elba, Marianne Jean-Baptiste and Chiwetel Ejiofor found some of their most rewarding roles in America. I would add some of my own thoughts here, but let’s instead go to William Henwood who has his own great wisdom.

“I think,” he told the BBC when they called to find out if his original tweet was perhaps taken out of context, that “if black people come to this country and don’t like mixing with white people, why are they here? If he [Henry] wants a lot of blacks around, go and live in a black country.”

Henwood, it has been said, is not a racist. Unfortunately, the person saying this is BNP chairman Nick Griffin who jumped in to defend Henwood, saying that “the real racism” was the “bullying by the BBC and by the political elite of ordinary British people, of various parties, who stand up and say what most ordinary people think”.

Nick Griffin also added, for good measure: “We are going to be an abused minority in our own homeland.” This seems a rather extreme reaction to Lenny Henry. I’ve watched him for years in Tiswas as Delbert Wilkins, as Theopolis P Wildebeest, and I’m going to go out on a limb here and say I just don’t think he has violent race-based civil war leadership in him. I think he was just making a point about equality. Henwood’s reaction was a perfect illustration of how far attitudes in this country may need to shift.

For many people, the first time they learnt that Lenny Henry was utterly British was back in 1975 – nearly 40 years ago – when he appeared on the talent show New Faces. As, very typically, the only black person to appear on British TV that evening, Henry would touch on the matter by cracking the joke that Enoch Powell had offered him £1,000 to “go home”. “But it only costs me 50p to get to Dudley!” Henry, just a boy then, would deliver the punchline in a mock-glib, chipper tone brimming with youthful naivety, but in reality it was a dark look at 1970s Britain and the attitudes a black person had to deal with. It’s up to us as voters to spell out to men like William Henwood that this joke isn’t funny any more.


http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/grace-dent-is-this-what-ukip-thinks-we-secretly-think-that-lenny-henry-should-go-and-live-in-a-black-country-its-time-to-fight-back-9297556.html

Saying that someone should emigrate to a black country is not the same as telling them to go home.

I'm not defending what was said, but these reporters really need to be accurate.

Raggamuffin wrote:Saying that someone should emigrate to a black country is not the same as telling them to go home.

I'm not defending what was said, but these reporters really need to be accurate.

Why should he emigrate when he is British when he only spoke of having equality?

Are you saying we should tell anyone to go to another country if they wish for equality?

Sorry where on earth does it claim he said for Henry to go home?


So the reporter is accurate, as she never claimed that

Didge wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:Saying that someone should emigrate to a black country is not the same as telling them to go home.

I'm not defending what was said, but these reporters really need to be accurate.

Why should he emigrate when he is British when he only spoke of having equality?

Are you saying we should tell anyone to go to another country if they wish for equality?

Sorry where on earth does it claim he said for Henry to go home?


So the reporter is accurate, as she never claimed that

Here:

Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.”

I'm not saying he should emigrate.

Is this down to that business of Lenny Henry saying there should be more black people in Midsomer Murders or whatever?

Raggamuffin wrote:

Didge wrote:


Why should he emigrate when he is British when he only spoke of having equality?

Are you saying we should tell anyone to go to another country if they wish for equality?

Sorry where on earth does it claim he said for Henry to go home?


So the reporter is accurate, as she never claimed that

Here:

Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.”

I'm not saying he should emigrate.

Is this down to that business of Lenny Henry saying there should be more black people in Midsomer Murders or whatever?

She is right, she did not say he said that though did she, try and read things in context Ragga, as that was poor. You do understand rejig, do you not?
He clearly used the view point on the colour of skin, as if Lenny was making derogatory remarks against whites, which he was not, but clearly this UKIP idiot took it as that and went onto a view point telling him and any black person coming here to basically fuck off as if they do not like whites

Didge wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Here:



I'm not saying he should emigrate.

Is this down to that business of Lenny Henry saying there should be more black people in Midsomer Murders or whatever?

She is right, she did not say he said that though did she, try and read things in context Ragga, as that was poor.
He clearly used the view point on the colour of skin, as if Lenny was making derogatory remarks against whites, which he was not, but clearly this UKIP idiot took it as that and went onto a view point telling him and any black person coming here to basically fuck off

It is in context as the two things have completely different meanings. I don't have time to remind myself of the exact story but Lenny Henry was being a bit silly about TV shows as I recall.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Didge wrote:


She is right, she did not say he said that though did she, try and read things in context Ragga, as that was poor.
He clearly used the view point on the colour of skin, as if Lenny was making derogatory remarks against whites, which he was not, but clearly this UKIP idiot took it as that and went onto a view point telling him and any black person coming here to basically fuck off

It is in context as the two things have completely different meanings. I don't have time to remind myself of the exact story but Lenny Henry was being a bit silly about TV shows as I recall.

Read again and see where you have gone wrong, I will highlight one word for you to show again you have taken out of context:


Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.

Didge wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

It is in context as the two things have completely different meanings. I don't have time to remind myself of the exact story but Lenny Henry was being a bit silly about TV shows as I recall.

Read again and see where you have gone wrong, I will highlight one word for you to show again you have taken out of context:


Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.

Well it's not a rejig is it?

Raggamuffin wrote:

Didge wrote:


Read again and see where you have gone wrong, I will highlight one word for you to show again you have taken out of context:


Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.

Well it's not a rejig is it?

Yes it is, sorry I have work to do and if you cannot see her point, I really cannot help you, because again telling a British person who is black to go live in a black country, means he does not view black people as being part of this country, the point you are clearly missing .


Have a good day

I know I've been told on this forum and Spekkensfrei by people here to eff off and live in another country...

It's what happens when people get angry - tough sh1t!

Didge wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Well it's not a rejig is it?

Yes it is, sorry I have work to do and if you cannot see her point, I really cannot help you, because again telling a British person who is black to go live in a black country, means he does not view black people as being part of this country, the point you are clearly missing .


Have a good day

I have work to do as well, so I don't have time to get into a silly argument with you. I think they mean different things - you don't - the end.

This is clearly racist as Lenny Henry was born in Britain and therefore UKIP members telling him to go elsewhere to be amongst black people is a racist remark that can not be defended or excused.

Anyone pretending otherwise is merely making themselves look foolish.Sometimes UKIP maybe accused of being racist when 'strictly speaking'they are not.

Well,this time,they are.

If he's British and we're all the same race as you keep saying, then why was he going on about how there should ae more blacks etc?


Seems he is the racist....!


And here it is, official, the cross party lib lab con smear campaign against UKIP......


"Ukip condemned by cross-party group for running 'racist' campaign
Aggressive move accusing Nigel Farage's party of 'Euracism' comes as study puts anti-EU vote in Europe at 30%
The first cross-party campaign to condemn Nigel Farage's party as racist is to be launched this week amid fresh polls showing Ukip may come first across England in the European elections in May.
The campaign is led by the former Labour immigration minister Barbara Roche, who claimed: "Ukip's campaign needs to be exposed for what it is, a racist campaign. The party is practising what is in effect a form of 'Euracism'. They are deploying the same language and tactics used by openly racist parties like the BNP, but instead of targeting migrants from Africa and Asia they are targeting migrants from within the EU."
Labour and Tory jitters over the rise of Ukip – which led European election opinion polls for the first time over the weekend – are manifesting in an increasingly public debate in both parties about whether to attack it or oppose its anti-immigration policies.
It comes as one Europe-wide study suggested that anti-EU parties such as Ukip could win more than 30% of the vote across the continent next month. Calculations by the Open Europe thinktank suggest hardline sceptics could take as many as 218 of the 751 seats available – although this conclusion was has been challenged by other analysts. A second poll put Ukip neck and neck with Labour in England, but trailing in Scotland and Wales...."

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/28/ukip-european-election-accused-of-racism


'Euracism'!!!!!





And this is what UKIP say.....


"The LibLabCon Cartel is frightened and will stoop to any depths to smear UKIP supporters – UKIP Leader Nigel Farage responds to Guardian report of concerted Establishment bid to brand UKIP ‘racist’
Nigel  Farage today condemned the three main Westminster parties for resorting to a "campaign of slurs" against UKIP supporters in a desperate bid to protect their establishment cartel and prevent his party winning the European elections next month.
The UKIP leader spoke out after a front page Guardian report revealed the launch of a cross-party campaign to brand UKIP as racist.
Former Labour immigration minister Barbara Roche is leading an anti-UKIP campaign by the Migration Matters Trust, which also has Tory and Lib Dem support, and has accused UKIP of "Euracism".
Mr Farage said: "I am really sorry that millions of people who have decided to vote UKIP next month now find themselves accused by the political establishment of supporting racism.
"This is like the incident between Gordon Brown and Gillian Duffy at the last general election writ large – this time it is not merely one person being slandered by one establishment party but huge numbers of decent British people under attack and all three Westminster parties levelling the charge of racism and bigotry.
 "Now we can see why none of the establishment parties will ever get immigration under control – they simply don't believe in doing so.
"So they are trying to browbeat the British public into abandoning UKIP and sticking with open-door immigration by using the most disgraceful slurs. This is the classic tactic of any cartel whose position is threatened by a new competitor in the market place.
"When UKIP was perceived mainly as a threat to the Conservative Party, it was David Cameron and his colleagues who used this tactic. Now we are recognised as a threat to the entire establishment it is all three parties that are slinging mud.
"I think the British public will take this extremely badly. I believe they want and appreciate the new choices being offered to them by UKIP on issues like immigration control and will certainly not appreciate being branded racist for doing so.
"The electorate is not in the mood to be intimidated by the political establishment and Messrs Cameron, Miliband and Clegg have just made another disastrous mistake. I call on all fair-minded British people to swing behind UKIP and teach these creeps a lesson they won't forget in a hurry."
"
http://www.ukip.org/the_liblabcon_cartel_is_frightened_and_will_stoop_to_any_depths_to_smear_ukip_supporters#

Raggamuffin wrote:Saying that someone should emigrate to a black country is not the same as telling them to go home.

I'm not defending what was said, but these reporters really need to be accurate.

It's the same as saying those who want sharia law should move to a Muslim country

BBC staff take 'unconscious bias' course to encourage more diverse recruitment

Senior BBC staff have taken a course in “unconscious bias” in a bid to stop them recruiting new employees "in their own image", the director of news has disclosed.

James Harding, who joined the BBC last year, said his staff had been given training to improve the diversity of new recruits, with targets to increase the representation of ethnic minorities. They are already offered video training on diversity issues, with online information to teach them how to challenge stereotypes and preconceptions about race.

The speech follows findings from the BBC Trust, published yesterday (Mon), which order BBC management to increase the number of ethnic minority faces in news and current affairs, both on screen and behind the camera.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/bbc/10794205/BBC-staff-take-unconscious-bias-course-to-encourage-more-diverse-recruitment.html

"Unconscious bias" - is this the latest offence? If someone hasn't actually said or done something racist they can be accused of thinking it without knowing it?

A simple answer to Tommy, its called trying to have equality, if people are being denied.

Oh is that the same speech where also Nigel claimed Romanians were criminally minded as well and of course is not using sacre tactics and trying to whip up fear then?







Press Release: Business leaders condemn Nigel Farage for branding Romanian migrants ‘criminals’
26 April 2014

Pro-European business leaders have condemned UKIP leader Nigel Farage for claiming that Romanian migrants had a "culture of criminality" and that Britons should be "wary" of Romanians who come and live on their street.

Farage made the comments in a Guardian interview, where he also linked concerns over EU migration to the number of Romanians who are arrested in the UK.

Alisdair McIntosh, Director of Business for New Europe, said:

"These comments show us what Nigel Farage is really thinking: not that EU migrants are bad for Britain's economy as he sometimes claims, but that he doesn't like them, branding them 'criminals' and discriminating on the basis of their nationality.

"There are thousands of Romanian migrants in the UK working hard and supporting our economy, as entrepreneurs, doctors, nurses and all kinds of other professions. Now we can see why UKIP don't mind taking votes that used to go to the BNP as there seem to be many similarities in their views."

http://www.bnegroup.org/media/press-release-business-leaders-condemn-nigel-farage-for-branding-romanian-m/

People don't want open door immigration, this is a fundamental part of EU membership and the only way out of it is to leave the EU.


Your argument rests on, you must have unlimited open door immigration or you are a racist.



Pathetic!

Tommy Monk wrote:People don't want open door immigration, this is a fundamental part of EU membership and the only way out of it is to leave the EU.


Your argument rests on, you must have unlimited open door immigration or you are a racist.



Pathetic!

I have no problem with having people concerned with having immigration controlled, I do have an issue, with idiots like Nigel using scare monger tactics castigating all Romanians based off ignorant prejudice.

So nice try you little weasel, but many are waking up to the fact Farage is a gutter snipe and is showing off all his hate in its full glory, as well as being a hypocritical idiot to say the least.

Hey the economy is growing stronger and unemployment is down, that will not do any favours for UKIP come the general election next here, never mind eh

Seems to me all the hate is coming from people like you against a perfectly reasonable and popular list of policies from UKIP.....




I repeat,your argument is, you must have open door unlimited immigration or you are a racist, or as we saw earlier in the guardian article explaining the cross party smear campaign against UKIP, the new made up word 'euracist'!!!!!


Pathetic!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:Seems to me all the hate is coming from people like you against a perfectly reasonable and popular list of policies from UKIP.....




I repeat,your argument is, you must have open door unlimited immigration or you are a racist, or as we saw earlier in the guardian article explaining the cross party smear campaign against UKIP, the new made up word 'euracist'!!!!!


Pathetic!!!

Hate is a very strong word, but no I do not hate something as I stated are nothing more than a joke, but nice deflection as usual away from the points Matti. You can repeat all you like, as seen it is racist to claim an ethnic group is criminal when there is no such biological evidence. That proves Nigel is also using smear and scare tactics which is ironic, showing you are quite happy for him to do that, but nobody can smear his party when they expose idiots who are racist, xenophobic and homophobic.
Not only is that hypocritical of UKIP, it shows them up for what they really are, they do not like it up them.

Really?

You must be the only person here who does not know of The notorious criminal activity of Romanian gypsies!

Tommy Monk wrote:Really?

You must be the only person here who does not know of The notorious criminal activity of Romanian gypsies!

All of them?


Show me the biology behind this claim and he never stated gypsies, he said Romanians, nice goal post change by the way

And you say you are all in favour for control over our borders, well, being in the EU means we have no control on our borders from EU nations, the only way out of this free movement is to get out of EU!





You are again putting up arguments to leave the EU!



I'm glad you agree!

Tommy Monk wrote:And you say you are all in favour for control over our borders, well, being in the EU means we have no control on our borders from EU nations, the only way out of this free movement is to get out of EU!





You are again putting up arguments to leave the EU!



I'm glad you agree!

Yes control to have people checked for criminal records, that non-EU migrants have jobs and are financially viable etc when coming to the country, as the vast majority of EU migrants come to work.
No EU country has borders to British migrants also, do you also want to deny them opportunities, being as Britain has over 6million ex-pats around the world with well over a million as some claim two with in the EU?

You cannot have it both ways, something you and other UKIPPERS neglect at every turn.

I see as usual you failed o back your evidence on Romanians committing crime and deflect from the point as usual because you had no evidence there is something biologically wrong with them


How easy again for me.

This is what makes me laugh at claims to smear, when UKIP do it daily, the irony and hypocrisy is incredible

 ::D:: 

It's a cultural thing dodge.....



And British people want proper control on borders, not open door unlimited immigration.

Tommy Monk wrote:It's a cultural thing dodge.....



And British people want proper control on borders, not open door unlimited immigration.

But are happy to have an open door the other, so much so 6 million have done so

Evidence please?


You can't compare a few hundred thousand retired and relatively wealthy scattered across warmer climes, massive contributesp to the local economy and not taking jobs from the local people, to the millions who come here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc.

Tommy Monk wrote:Evidence please?


You can't compare a few hundred thousand retired and relatively wealthy scattered across warmer climes

Top 10 destinations for UK expats*

Australia 1,062,000 (251,000)

USA 829,000 (140,000)

Spain 808,000 (104,000)

Canada 608,000 (157,000)

Ireland 289,000 (126,000

France 253,000 (57,000)

New Zealand 248,000 (54,000)

South Africa 219,000 (38,000)

Germany 97,000 (39,000)

UAE 65,000 (680)

*Table shows numbers of expats in each country, and in brackets the number of pensioners


http://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/nov/26/where-do-uk-expats-live

And in Europe....?


Not that many really, and you are comparing wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????



Really?



British people want out of open door free movement of unlimited immigration, and the only way to do that is to get out of The EU!

Tommy Monk wrote:And in Europe....?


Not that many really, and you are comparing wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????



Really?



British people want out of open door free movement of unlimited immigration, and the only way to do that is to get out of The EU!

Tommy please remember that Didge is ill.

Shady wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:And in Europe....?


Not that many really, and you are comparing wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????



Really?



British people want out of open door free movement of unlimited immigration, and the only way to do that is to get out of The EU!

Tommy please remember that Didge is ill.

Ha Ha, I do love how I get to you so much you have to chat via PM's with other posters bout me.


That is a sign of really winding you up

Tommy Monk wrote:And in Europe....?


Not that many really, and you are comparing wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????



Really?



British people want out of open door free movement of unlimited immigration, and the only way to do that is to get out of The EU!

2 million is not many now, my that is funny, so that would not be many here then by breaking down the numbers of each ethnic EU populations here then Matti?


That backfired on you did it not?

We were talking about EU open door unlimited immigration and you start posting about British ex pats in USA and Australia!




What a bell end!



And you are trying to compare wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????


Leaving the EU will not stop wealthy British retiring in a warmer country, be it EU or not.


We have plenty of wealthy people here from outside the EU, so being in EU or not is not important on that count.


But it will mean we have control on who can or can't come here, and that is a good thing. We want out of The open door unlimited immigration, and the only way to get out of that is to get out of The EU.

Tommy Monk wrote:We were talking about EU open door unlimited immigration and you start posting about British ex pats in USA and Australia!




What a bell end!



And you are trying to compare wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????


Leaving the EU will not stop wealthy British retiring in a warmer country, be it EU or not.


We have plenty of wealthy people here from outside the EU, so being in EU or not is not important on that count.


But it will mean we have control on who can or can't come here, and that is a good thing. We want out of The open door unlimited immigration, and the only way to get out of that is to get out of The EU.

PMSL, you made a cock up, it showed many living within the EU, fear more for example like Spain, where there is nearly a million Brits, that is higher than any EU ethnic group here and many of those in Spain great little Britain's of which have you asked the Spanish if they mind?
You see this is where your argument always falls down, you think they are all wealthy, which you assume, but not offer evidence or ignore the fact plenty work.

I suggest you read again:




Australia 1,062,000 (251,000)

USA 829,000 (140,000)

Spain 808,000 (104,000)

Canada 608,000 (157,000)

Ireland 289,000 (126,000

France 253,000 (57,000)

New Zealand 248,000 (54,000)

South Africa 219,000 (38,000)

Germany 97,000 (39,000)

UAE 65,000 (680)

*Table shows numbers of expats in each country, and in brackets the number of pensioners

Source: IPPR, DWP.

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/nov/26/where-do-uk-expats-live


I mean look at the numbers in New Zealand, that is 5% of its population, the same for Ireland and Australia, you do not see them whinging and moaning though.and we have plenty of wealthy foreigners here also, but you only look at points one sided, which shows your views always backfire

You show ten countries, only 4 are in EU and total of about 1.3 million.



Nearly all of them will be wealthy retired people, self sufficient, bringing money to The local economies and not taking jobs from the locals.


This is not a new thing, or the result of EU open door free movement. These people have always been welcomed where ever they choose to go.


We also have wealthy people here from outside the EU so proving that free movement open door immigration is not needed for this to happen.



But what we don't want is millions of people being allowed through open door unlimited immigration to here, arriving with Fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc!!!!!



At the moment that is happening and while we remain in EU, We can't get out of The open door unlimited immigration which is a fundamental part of EU membership.


Which bit don't you understand?

Tommy Monk wrote:You show ten countries, only 4 are in EU and total of about 1.3 million.



Nearly all of them will be wealthy retired people, self sufficient, bringing money to The local economies and not taking jobs from the locals.


This is not a new thing, or the result of EU open door free movement. These people have always been welcomed where ever they choose to go.


We also have wealthy people here from outside the EU so proving that free movement open door immigration is not needed for this to happen.



But what we don't want is millions of people being allowed through open door unlimited immigration to here, arriving with Fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc!!!!!



At the moment that is happening and while we remain in EU, We can't get out of The open door unlimited immigration which is a fundamental part of EU membership.


Which bit don't you understand?

Where is the evidence nearly all of them are wealthy?

Saying they are is not evidence, seriously you crack me up with what you come out with


The reality is the vast majority of EU migrants are working, how many are claiming JSA Matti out of the many here?


This is what makes me laugh, none of us want people here who are taking the piss, but the vast majority do not take the piss and do work hard and contribute greatly to this nation, something you neglect, all reports show this, except the poor migrant watch that lives in fear like you so.

smelly_bandit wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:Saying that someone should emigrate to a black country is not the same as telling them to go home.

I'm not defending what was said, but these reporters really need to be accurate.

It's the same as saying those who want sharia law should move to a Muslim country

Not really at all. Henry is saying that a multicultural society with many ethnic groups should have TV shows that reflect that diversity -- not proposing a whirlwind of imposing a draconian legal system upon the country. The former is a lot more reasonable than the latter.

Didge wrote:The fact that the comedian Lenny Henry is a British man born in Dudley, close to Birmingham, seems – to me at least – something as deep-rooted in the British conscience as other, similar doofus-grade Who Wants To Be a Millionaire questions such as: “Where is the Queen’s Scottish residence?” or “Which country did Paddington Bear come from the deepest, darkest part of?”
It’s impossible as a British person to say how one originally found these things out. One just knows. Still, the fact of Lenny Henry’s country of birth has eluded the Ukip candidate for Enfield, William Henwood, who suggested over the weekend that Lenny Henry should “emigrate to a black country”, if he’s not happy living with “whites”.

Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.” He is unapologetic and indignant at the fuss. Keeping in mind that Ukip seems to be gaining considerable popularity in this country for being those ruddy great blokes with the brass balls to say what we’re all secretly thinking, it is useful to know what they secretly think we all think.

A recent episode of Channel 4’s Gogglebox – the programme that watches the everyday man watching telly – showed almost every sofa being won over by Farage’s “Tell it as you see it” chutzpah. Presumably, the trickle-down effect of this is buffoons like Henwood treating us to the full majesty of their “everyman” grunts before spinning round with a confident, “Am I right, guys?” For the good of Great Britain we need to keep whacking these prats back into place, like a depressing game of beach-front whack-a-mole, with the vehement shout of, “No, pillock, you’re absolutely wrong.”

The most galling part of Henwood’s musings is that it was in response to an erudite Bafta speech by Lenny Henry about the time-worn British theatrical and televisual problem of representation for non-white actors. Clearly, this discrepancy – the historical and socio-political reasons for it plus the debate of how to rectify the problem – is a topic which could fill many thousands of words. But in its briefest form, there’s a reason that fine British actors like Idris Elba, Marianne Jean-Baptiste and Chiwetel Ejiofor found some of their most rewarding roles in America. I would add some of my own thoughts here, but let’s instead go to William Henwood who has his own great wisdom.

“I think,” he told the BBC when they called to find out if his original tweet was perhaps taken out of context, that “if black people come to this country and don’t like mixing with white people, why are they here? If he [Henry] wants a lot of blacks around, go and live in a black country.”

Henwood, it has been said, is not a racist. Unfortunately, the person saying this is BNP chairman Nick Griffin who jumped in to defend Henwood, saying that “the real racism” was the “bullying by the BBC and by the political elite of ordinary British people, of various parties, who stand up and say what most ordinary people think”.

Nick Griffin also added, for good measure: “We are going to be an abused minority in our own homeland.” This seems a rather extreme reaction to Lenny Henry. I’ve watched him for years in Tiswas as Delbert Wilkins, as Theopolis P Wildebeest, and I’m going to go out on a limb here and say I just don’t think he has violent race-based civil war leadership in him. I think he was just making a point about equality. Henwood’s reaction was a perfect illustration of how far attitudes in this country may need to shift.

For many people, the first time they learnt that Lenny Henry was utterly British was back in 1975 – nearly 40 years ago – when he appeared on the talent show New Faces. As, very typically, the only black person to appear on British TV that evening, Henry would touch on the matter by cracking the joke that Enoch Powell had offered him £1,000 to “go home”. “But it only costs me 50p to get to Dudley!” Henry, just a boy then, would deliver the punchline in a mock-glib, chipper tone brimming with youthful naivety, but in reality it was a dark look at 1970s Britain and the attitudes a black person had to deal with. It’s up to us as voters to spell out to men like William Henwood that this joke isn’t funny any more.


http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/grace-dent-is-this-what-ukip-thinks-we-secretly-think-that-lenny-henry-should-go-and-live-in-a-black-country-its-time-to-fight-back-9297556.html

In the 60s and 70s we were all firmly convinced that, after the debacle of WWII, people would never again allow themselves to be manipulated by a xenophobic racist bigot. Now, the squashed tomato-faced, beer swilling, public schoolboy that is Nigel Farage might not be another Hitler, but he is stirring up all the latent Little Englanders, pandering to the very worst traits of their ignorance and prejudice. Thankfully, I have a firm belief that for every one of them, their are two of us and sanity will prevail in the end. But complacency is not an option against a group of people that would divide and set neighbour against neighbour, simply because of the colour of their skin, their religion or their sexuality. All dragons should be slain, and Farage is rather a pitiful little dragon.

Sassy wrote:

Didge wrote:The fact that the comedian Lenny Henry is a British man born in Dudley, close to Birmingham, seems – to me at least – something as deep-rooted in the British conscience as other, similar doofus-grade Who Wants To Be a Millionaire questions such as: “Where is the Queen’s Scottish residence?” or “Which country did Paddington Bear come from the deepest, darkest part of?”
It’s impossible as a British person to say how one originally found these things out. One just knows. Still, the fact of Lenny Henry’s country of birth has eluded the Ukip candidate for Enfield, William Henwood, who suggested over the weekend that Lenny Henry should “emigrate to a black country”, if he’s not happy living with “whites”.

Henwood’s oafish mutterings were clearly a rejig of the popular Conversational Racism For Beginners’ phrase: “Get back to your own country.” He is unapologetic and indignant at the fuss. Keeping in mind that Ukip seems to be gaining considerable popularity in this country for being those ruddy great blokes with the brass balls to say what we’re all secretly thinking, it is useful to know what they secretly think we all think.

A recent episode of Channel 4’s Gogglebox – the programme that watches the everyday man watching telly – showed almost every sofa being won over by Farage’s “Tell it as you see it” chutzpah. Presumably, the trickle-down effect of this is buffoons like Henwood treating us to the full majesty of their “everyman” grunts before spinning round with a confident, “Am I right, guys?” For the good of Great Britain we need to keep whacking these prats back into place, like a depressing game of beach-front whack-a-mole, with the vehement shout of, “No, pillock, you’re absolutely wrong.”

The most galling part of Henwood’s musings is that it was in response to an erudite Bafta speech by Lenny Henry about the time-worn British theatrical and televisual problem of representation for non-white actors. Clearly, this discrepancy – the historical and socio-political reasons for it plus the debate of how to rectify the problem – is a topic which could fill many thousands of words. But in its briefest form, there’s a reason that fine British actors like Idris Elba, Marianne Jean-Baptiste and Chiwetel Ejiofor found some of their most rewarding roles in America. I would add some of my own thoughts here, but let’s instead go to William Henwood who has his own great wisdom.

“I think,” he told the BBC when they called to find out if his original tweet was perhaps taken out of context, that “if black people come to this country and don’t like mixing with white people, why are they here? If he [Henry] wants a lot of blacks around, go and live in a black country.”

Henwood, it has been said, is not a racist. Unfortunately, the person saying this is BNP chairman Nick Griffin who jumped in to defend Henwood, saying that “the real racism” was the “bullying by the BBC and by the political elite of ordinary British people, of various parties, who stand up and say what most ordinary people think”.

Nick Griffin also added, for good measure: “We are going to be an abused minority in our own homeland.” This seems a rather extreme reaction to Lenny Henry. I’ve watched him for years in Tiswas as Delbert Wilkins, as Theopolis P Wildebeest, and I’m going to go out on a limb here and say I just don’t think he has violent race-based civil war leadership in him. I think he was just making a point about equality. Henwood’s reaction was a perfect illustration of how far attitudes in this country may need to shift.

For many people, the first time they learnt that Lenny Henry was utterly British was back in 1975 – nearly 40 years ago – when he appeared on the talent show New Faces. As, very typically, the only black person to appear on British TV that evening, Henry would touch on the matter by cracking the joke that Enoch Powell had offered him £1,000 to “go home”. “But it only costs me 50p to get to Dudley!” Henry, just a boy then, would deliver the punchline in a mock-glib, chipper tone brimming with youthful naivety, but in reality it was a dark look at 1970s Britain and the attitudes a black person had to deal with. It’s up to us as voters to spell out to men like William Henwood that this joke isn’t funny any more.


http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/grace-dent-is-this-what-ukip-thinks-we-secretly-think-that-lenny-henry-should-go-and-live-in-a-black-country-its-time-to-fight-back-9297556.html

In the 60s and 70s we were all firmly convinced that, after the debacle of WWII, people would never again allow themselves to be manipulated by a xenophobic racist bigot.   Now, the squashed tomato-faced, beer swilling, public schoolboy that is Nigel Farage might not be another Hitler, but he is stirring up all the latent Little Englanders, pandering to the very worst traits of their ignorance and prejudice.   Thankfully, I have a firm belief that for every one of them, their are two of us and sanity will prevail in the end.   But complacency is not an option against a group of people that would divide and set neighbour against neighbour, simply because of the colour of their skin, their religion or their sexuality.   All dragons should be slain, and Farage is rather a pitiful little dragon.

What a wonderful post!

It worries me that people have these prejudices though that Farage is able to manipulate them so easily.

UKIP have managed to be insult and demean women,gay people and now black people yet their popularity does not seem to wain.It makes me fear there are some people with some pretty ugly mindsets out there

FluffyBunny wrote:

Sassy wrote:


In the 60s and 70s we were all firmly convinced that, after the debacle of WWII, people would never again allow themselves to be manipulated by a xenophobic racist bigot.   Now, the squashed tomato-faced, beer swilling, public schoolboy that is Nigel Farage might not be another Hitler, but he is stirring up all the latent Little Englanders, pandering to the very worst traits of their ignorance and prejudice.   Thankfully, I have a firm belief that for every one of them, their are two of us and sanity will prevail in the end.   But complacency is not an option against a group of people that would divide and set neighbour against neighbour, simply because of the colour of their skin, their religion or their sexuality.   All dragons should be slain, and Farage is rather a pitiful little dragon.

What a wonderful post!

It worries me that people have these prejudices though that Farage is able to manipulate them so easily.

UKIP have managed to be insult and demean women,gay people and now black people yet their popularity does not seem to wain.It makes me fear there are some people with some pretty ugly mindsets out there

There are indeed Fluffy, which is why you should never let your guard down and challenge them at every opportunity. We had one mouthing off in the pub, we soon destroyed all his arguments and off he went, tail between his legs. Never let them get away with anything. It only takes good people not to speak up for evil to take hold.

And just to prove my point:

Ukip in racism row after candidate describes Mo Farah as 'African'
David Wycherley takes to social media site to ask 'how Mo Farah, an African … has won a Gold medal for Great Britain'

A fresh Ukip candidate was embroiled in a row over racism on Tuesday when it was discovered he had taken to Facebook to argue that Team GB Olympic star, Mo Farah, isn't British because he is an "African".

The revelation came as a Ukip candidate who had urged Lenny Henry to "go back to a black country" left the party and two other members were suspended in a bid to clean up the party's image. Nigel Farage claimed the party may have been infiltrated by people trying to bring it down.
Wycherley facebook comment David Wycherley is standing for Ukip candidate for the Rushall-Shelfield ward in Walsall. Photograph: Facebook

But simultaneously it emerged that David Wycherley, standing for Ukip candidate for the Rushall-Shelfield ward in Walsall, had asked his Facebook friends to explain "how Mo Farah, an African … has won a Gold medal for Great Britain".

Farah, who grew up in Hounslow in London, became a double Olympic champion for Team GB at the 2012 Olympics and was later awarded a CBE by HM the Queen for services to athletics.

In other comments Wycherley joked about "starving Africans" whilst complaining about his water bill.

The party announced on Tuesday that candidate William Henwood had resigned after he urged the comedian Lenny Henry to go back to a "black country". A Ukip spokesman said Henwood had resigned his membership of Ukip after it was "mutually agreed this would be the best course" acknowledging that his comments had "caused enormous offence".

Ukip also confirmed it will expel two unnamed members, a former member of the British National party and a donor to the English Defence League.

Ukip has resisted, expelling MEPs and councillors over controversial remarks about Muslims, gay people and women in the past.

However, it appears to have acted against the two members because Farage imposed a ban on former members of the BNP and EDL joining Ukip.

Earlier, Farage dismissed rows about the views of candidates and members, saying "there is this idea that because one person or two people make silly comments that represents the entire party".

He also revealed suspicions that "one or two people have joined Ukip with the intention of perhaps not doing it any good".

"I'm investigating that, looking at that as we speak," he told the BBC.

Farage also hit back at a Guardian report that a cross party campaign is being launched to brand his party as expressing racist views.

Farage said: "I am really sorry that millions of people who have decided to vote UKIP next month now find themselves accused by the political establishment of supporting racism.

"This is like the incident between Gordon Brown and Gillian Duffy at the last general election writ large – this time it is not merely one person being slandered by one establishment party but huge numbers of decent British people under attack and all three Westminster parties levelling the charge of racism and bigotry. So they are trying to browbeat the British public into abandoning Ukip and sticking with open-door immigration by using the most disgraceful slurs. This is the classic tactic of any cartel whose position is threatened by a new competitor in the market place.

"When Ukip was perceived mainly as a threat to the Conservative party, it was David Cameron and his colleagues who used this tactic. Now we are recognised as a threat to the entire establishment it is all three parties that are slinging mud."

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/29/ukip-wycherley-mo-farah-racism-row-facebook

A certain kind of politician has always been able to make a career by telling the members of the majority group in society that they're being victimized and diminished by people who are "other" -- foreign, different ethnicity, different religion, even different gender.

It gives those voters an easy explanation and culprit for their problems; it gives them a satisfying sensation of "fighting back" against persecution by voting for the right candidate; it gives them the sense of membership in the good-guys group -- it's like a drug!

Ben_Reilly wrote:A certain kind of politician has always been able to make a career by telling the members of the majority group in society that they're being victimized and diminished by people who are "other" -- foreign, different ethnicity, different religion, even different gender.

It gives those voters an easy explanation and culprit for their problems; it gives them a satisfying sensation of "fighting back" against persecution by voting for the right candidate; it gives them the sense of membership in the good-guys group -- it's like a drug!

Yup...just like the tories have done with the disabled and out of work.....

Didge wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:You show ten countries, only 4 are in EU and total of about 1.3 million.
Nearly all of them will be wealthy retired people, self sufficient, bringing money to The local economies and not taking jobs from the locals.
This is not a new thing, or the result of EU open door free movement. These people have always been welcomed where ever they choose to go.
We also have wealthy people here from outside the EU so proving that free movement open door immigration is not needed for this to happen.
But what we don't want is millions of people being allowed through open door unlimited immigration to here, arriving with Fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc!!!!!
At the moment that is happening and while we remain in EU, We can't get out of The open door unlimited immigration which is a fundamental part of EU membership.
Which bit don't you understand?

Where is the evidence nearly all of them are wealthy?
Saying they are is not evidence, seriously you crack me up with what you come out with
The reality is the vast majority of EU migrants are working, how many are claiming JSA Matti out of the many here?
This is what makes me laugh, none of us want people here who are taking the piss, but the vast majority do not take the piss and do work hard and contribute greatly to this nation, something you neglect, all reports show this, except the poor migrant watch that lives in fear like you so.

Quarter of eastern European workers 'pay just £1 a week in tax', says report

MigrationWatch UK, which campaigns for tougher immigration laws, says many
lower-paid eastern European immigrants receive more in benefits than they
pay in tax

Research from think-tank Migration Watch said mmigrants who work for the minimum wage make “virtually no net contribution”, said MigrationWatch UK.


A quarter of eastern Europeans pay just £1 a week net in tax despite being in
work, migration campaigners have claimed in a new report.


Research from think-tank Migration Watch said immigrants who work for the
minimum wage make “virtually no net contribution”.


Tax rules also mean that if the immigrants are in a couple they can receive
more in tax credits and other benefits than they pay in tax.



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/10796558/Quarter-of-eastern-European-workers-pay-just-1-a-week-in-tax-says-report.html




Then add on the cost in benefits to the person already here who would have otherwise had the job......


Highly skilled and well needed immigrants????



This madness has to stop!

UKIP is not about racism, it's not anti European, it is anti EU dictatorship and wants end to the open door unlimited immigration madness.


Mo Farah was born in Somalia to somalian parents, so he is somalian.


And while you are there bleating about some ex UKIPer for having an opinion, let's remember that labour lib dem and Tory MPs are constantly in the news for real serious offences like fraudulently fiddling expenses, or claiming second home allowance to house parents or gay lovers etc, and are more likely to be in prison than the average member of public.


Who would seriously vote for those cretins???

Tommy Monk wrote:UKIP is not about racism, it's not anti European, it is anti EU dictatorship and wants end to the open door unlimited immigration madness.


Mo Farah was born in Somalia to somalian parents, so he is somalian.


And while you are there bleating about some ex UKIPer for having an opinion, let's remember that labour lib dem and Tory MPs are constantly in the news for real serious offences like fraudulently fiddling expenses, or claiming second home allowance to house parents or gay lovers etc, and are more likely to be in prison than the average member of public.


Who would seriously vote for those cretins???

Wrong again, he is a British citizen and who would vote for an incompetent party that has no viable economic policies that places all its eggs in one basket on leaving the EU, of which it also has no viable exit plans for doing so, basing this also off incorrect figures it believes on the amount it will save from doing so, let alone for example having to the pay EU export tariffs which could make many small business who trade solely in the EU go bust. Companies that are already foreign and have other sites within the EU would also no doubt close down its operations here due to simplicity, because of it would become more expensive to now trade from Britain than it did from within the EU. These are many points that sadly many jumping to UKIP do not see, they are fed scare tactics about the EU and immigrants, yet as seen none know what damage it could possible do to the UK or again the fact UKIP have no credible policies, reliant solely on Britain leaving

victorisnotamused wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:A certain kind of politician has always been able to make a career by telling the members of the majority group in society that they're being victimized and diminished by people who are "other" -- foreign, different ethnicity, different religion, even different gender.

It gives those voters an easy explanation and culprit for their problems; it gives them a satisfying sensation of "fighting back" against persecution by voting for the right candidate; it gives them the sense of membership in the good-guys group -- it's like a drug!

Yup...just like the tories have done with the disabled and out of work.....

Another great example, and some of our U.S. politicians do this too -- the amazing magic trick of convincing people who live in nice houses and have good, stable jobs to envy the poor.

Didge wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:We were talking about EU open door unlimited immigration and you start posting about British ex pats in USA and Australia!




What a bell end!



And you are trying to compare wealthy retired people who would be welcome anywhere an the world, bringing and spending money, totally self sufficient and not taking jobs from local people, to the millions who arrive here with fuck all and take jobs from the local people, driving down wages and driving up cost of living, putting strain on infrastructure, NHS, housing, roads, schools, local council services etc??????


Leaving the EU will not stop wealthy British retiring in a warmer country, be it EU or not.


We have plenty of wealthy people here from outside the EU, so being in EU or not is not important on that count.


But it will mean we have control on who can or can't come here, and that is a good thing. We want out of The open door unlimited immigration, and the only way to get out of that is to get out of The EU.

PMSL, you made a cock up, it showed many living within the EU, fear more for example like Spain, where there is nearly a million Brits, that is higher than any EU ethnic group here and many of those in Spain great little Britain's of which have you asked the Spanish if they mind?
You see this is where your argument always falls down, you think they are all wealthy, which you assume, but not offer evidence or ignore the fact plenty work.

I suggest you read again:




Australia 1,062,000 (251,000)

USA 829,000 (140,000)

Spain 808,000 (104,000)

Canada 608,000 (157,000)

Ireland 289,000 (126,000

France 253,000 (57,000)

New Zealand 248,000 (54,000)

South Africa 219,000 (38,000)

Germany 97,000 (39,000)

UAE 65,000 (680)

*Table shows numbers of expats in each country, and in brackets the number of pensioners

Source: IPPR, DWP.

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/nov/26/where-do-uk-expats-live


I mean look at the numbers in New Zealand, that is 5% of its population, the same for Ireland and Australia, you do not see them whinging and moaning though.and we have plenty of wealthy foreigners here also, but you only look at points one sided, which shows your views always backfire

I whinge about you Bloody Lazy Pommies all the Time        Come here with nothing and steal out Public services, take local jobs, drive down the wages and standards of living and bring their "culture" of not adapting with them        You don't even bring good food with you like every one else does          


 ::troll:: 

veya_victaous wrote:

Didge wrote:


PMSL, you made a cock up, it showed many living within the EU, fear more for example like Spain, where there is nearly a million Brits, that is higher than any EU ethnic group here and many of those in Spain great little Britain's of which have you asked the Spanish if they mind?
You see this is where your argument always falls down, you think they are all wealthy, which you assume, but not offer evidence or ignore the fact plenty work.

I suggest you read again:




Australia 1,062,000 (251,000)

USA 829,000 (140,000)

Spain 808,000 (104,000)

Canada 608,000 (157,000)

Ireland 289,000 (126,000

France 253,000 (57,000)

New Zealand 248,000 (54,000)

South Africa 219,000 (38,000)

Germany 97,000 (39,000)

UAE 65,000 (680)

*Table shows numbers of expats in each country, and in brackets the number of pensioners

Source: IPPR, DWP.

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/nov/26/where-do-uk-expats-live


I mean look at the numbers in New Zealand, that is 5% of its population, the same for Ireland and Australia, you do not see them whinging and moaning though.and we have plenty of wealthy foreigners here also, but you only look at points one sided, which shows your views always backfire

I whinge about you Bloody Lazy Pommies all the Time        Come here with nothing and steal out Public services, take local jobs, drive down the wages and standards of living and bring their "culture" of not adapting with them        You don't even bring good food with you like every one else does          


 ::troll:: 

if I did come to Aus and would love to do so, my Banana sandwiches will ensure I do not through immigration.

My drinking buddy moved back eight years ago to Perth and has not looked back since, nor have her children. Went with a suitcase each.

Had to work - did so -and living the life of reilly. Does not want to come back to England.