A Warm Oldham Welcome for Religious Murder Fans

When I see the word “interfaith”, I tend to suspect “idiocy” is a better description. I wish it weren’t so. But all too often that term is mild, if anything.

Consider a new case in point:

Faith leaders from across Greater Manchester met to discuss how communities can tackle terrorism in the wake of the Manchester Arena attack. Leaders from the Jewish, Christian, Sikh, Buddhist and Hindu faiths joined their Muslim friends at The Werneth Suite Conference Centre, in Oldham, on Friday night. They were also joined by the honourable Shaykhs of the Sufi Shrine in Pakistan as guests of honour. Shaykh Naqeeb ur Rehman and Shaykh Hassan Haseeb ur Rehman have worked for years to promote peace and campaign against terrorism. They visited the UK as a show of solidarity with the British people.

Here they are, all happy clappy. Rehman fils is on the left and Rehman père is second from right.



Oh dear. Now have a look at “honourable” Hassan Haseeb ur Rehman on video. Excited and agitated, he is shouting his support for Mumtaz Qadri, the man who murdered Pakistani politician Salman Taseer in 2011 for “blasphemy” and was executed by Pakistan for his crime last year. A big picture of Qadri is on the wall behind Rehman. His father is seated beneath it, watching his ranting son with approval.



Here he is firing up the crowd at Mumtaz Qadri’s funeral. His father was theretoo, paying his respects to the murderer.






This Newsnight report by Secunder Kermani explains the depressing background to the Mumtaz Qadri story.







Pakistan’s religious minorities, liberals and secularists are facing utterly horrific hate campaigns. And here in Britain we fete the haters. For “peace”, you see. Oh yes, of course. Reading on about the Oldham meeting, one finds another rather obvious indicator that something is quite wrong here:

The Counter Terrorism Conference, organised by The Ramadhan Foundation, sought to address what can be done to bring communities together and address terrorism.
Mohammed Shafiq, chief executive of the Ramadhan Foundation, said: “The Ramadhan Foundation in partnership with the Shaykhs of Eidgah Sharif are hosting this important conference to send a clear message against terrorism. Those that carry out these evil crimes, finance them or support them are enemies of the whole of humanity.”

Shafiq and the Ramadhan Foundation have an awful record. The thoroughly noxious hate preacher and Hitler fan Yusuf al-Qaradawi, for example, is “a man of moderation and widely respected through the world”.
And yet Shafiq wants everyone to “reflect on our language”. Ho ho.



All of this is not hard to figure out. Indeed, the Rehmans toured the UK just last summer and were heavily criticised.

Yet none of this matters. Greater Manchester worthies, police officers, and Labour MP Afzal Khan were keen to meet the Rehmans, as you can see.

Enough is never enough.



“So you think some politicians should be shot? Jolly good!”




Afzal Khan MP doing his bit for Labour




http://hurryupharry.org/2017/07/24/a-warm-oldham-welcome-for-religious-murder-fans/

Hi Thorin.
Going by your last picture what worries me is the number of non-Brit
MPs. Will the day come when our own people are outnumbered and new, foreign laws installed? Will churches be turned into Mosques?
I hate to think.

stardesk wrote:Hi Thorin.
Going by your last picture what worries me is the number of non-Brit
MPs. Will the day come when our own people are outnumbered and new, foreign laws installed? Will churches be turned into Mosques?
I hate to think.

Hi Stardesk

Its not so much a view on people foreign per say, but on what people believe that come to this country.
You say about laws in the future, but here even today, such a hate preacher is being welcomed to a conference to deal with terrorism. Its disgusting on ever level.

So if you have an influx of people from some countries that hold prejudiced views against women, homosexuals, religious minorities etc. Then this is worrying and even more so for those women, homosexuals, religious minorities. Whilst many people do not enforce their religious beliefs and that they do as personal beliefs. But this mass increased of people with such views, will just further segregate society, when its over such a short time frame. When they also congregate into the same areas and thus are not mixed within society.

Hence why all schools, should be secular and neutral. That then all generations are taught neutrally and without religious and discriminating bias.

stardesk wrote:Hi Thorin.
Going by your last picture what worries me is the number of non-Brit
MPs. Will the day come when our own people are outnumbered and new, foreign laws installed? Will churches be turned into Mosques?
I hate to think.

Democracy is a bitch, ain't it?  That's what is happening in the US, in states like Texas, Colorado, New Mexico and Arizona.  It drives the Republicans wild, because Hispanics vote overwhelmingly Democratic.

But you've gotta go with the game you bought into.  You can't change the rules just because you are losing.  That would be a poor loser...and besides, loss of democracy means rise in oligarchy, and nothing says the Imams can't take over there, too.  Then where would you be?

Now poor old Stardesk must be getting an inkling of what those Africans, Chinese, native American, Aboriginal, Maori, Indian and Pakistani chaps and chapettes must have been thinking and feeling over the centuries, watching all of those pale skinned foreigners invading their homelands...

'Life's a bitch !', isn't it Stardesk, old chap ?

Woolfie old chap I understand only too well what you're saying. After years of studying and research I came to understand just how much Western policies and way of life had interfered with the ways of life of indigenous people. Whist we may have brought them technology and medical knowledge, it's a crying shame a lot of foreign nations and nationals no longer have their own, traditional ways.

Stardesk is right...!

To add to my last comment, during the late 1950's I should have gone to Olduvai Gorge, in Kenya, to help Dr. Louis Leakey to look for fossils etc of early man. But the Mau Mau war started and put a stop to that. The war was intitially caused by Western influence on the Kikuyu tribe. The young men were drifting off to the townships looking for work but instead they were getting drunk. The chief of the tribe, Jomo Kenyata, along with the elders of the tribe decided it was time to do something about this incursion by foreign settlers and destruction of their way of life, hence they went to war.

Went to War? you call killing innocent Men, women and children going to war? Children and Babies cut to pieces with Parangs, Women raped and if pregnant cut open and the foetus nailed to a door ! The fucking Mau Mau were shot where ever we found them, Savages.

nicko wrote:Went to War?   you call killing innocent Men, women and children going to war?   Children and Babies cut to pieces with Parangs,  Women raped and if pregnant cut open and the foetus nailed to a door !   The fucking Mau Mau were shot where ever we found them,  Savages.

And some of the British were also savages committing war crimes Nicko in Kenya at this time

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mau_Mau_Uprising#British_war_crimes

Not surprising when you see what the Mau Mau did !

nicko wrote:Not surprising when you see what the Mau Mau did !

How is it surprising when many innocents as seen were murdered, raped or placed in concentration camps?

Have you read what actually happened to many innocent people Nicko?

What the Mau Mau did was appalling and so was the British war crimes. You take out the terrorists, not thousands of innocent people within concentration camps and enclosed villages..

[hAVE YOU READ WHAT HAPPENED TO INNOCENT PEOPLE] I SAW WHAT HAPPENED TO INNOCENT WHITE MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN !

nicko wrote:[hAVE YOU READ WHAT HAPPENED TO INNOCENT PEOPLE]    I SAW WHAT HAPPENED TO INNOCENT WHITE MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN !

How does that make the murdering of innocent civilians congregating them in concentration camps ever okay?

So you believe two wrongs make a right?

I condemned what the Mau Mau did, why can you not condemn what the British did to many civillians with the mass evidence I showed you of crimes they committed?

If the Mau Mau had not been complete savages then they would not have been treated as such, in time of War I believe in an Eye for an Eye, What ever you believe, we never tortured and mutilated children as they did !

nicko wrote:If the Mau Mau had not been complete savages then they would not have been treated as such,   in time of War I believe in an Eye for an Eye, What ever you believe, we never tortured and mutilated children as they did !

Yes the British did and that is where you are wrong Nicko

Caroline Elkins, a professor at Harvard, spent nearly 10 years compiling the evidence contained in her book Britain's Gulag: the Brutal End of Empire in Kenya. She started her research with the belief that the British account of the suppression of the Kikuyu's Mau Mau revolt in the 1950s was largely accurate. Then she discovered that most of the documentation had been destroyed. She worked through the remaining archives, and conducted 600 hours of interviews with Kikuyu survivors – rebels and loyalists – and British guards, settlers and officials. Her book is fully and thoroughly documented. It won the Pulitzer prize. But as far as Sandbrook, James and other imperial apologists are concerned, it might as well never have been written.

Elkins reveals that the British detained not 80,000 Kikuyu, as the official histories maintain, but almost the entire population of one and a half million people, in camps and fortified villages. There, thousands were beaten to death or died from malnutrition, typhoid, tuberculosis and dysentery. In some camps almost all the children died.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/apr/23/british-empire-crimes-ignore-atrocities

Steady on folks! What we must bear in mind is they were trying to defend their country and way of life, which I'm sure is carried out by other indigenous people, such as the Aborigines, the American Indians, various people of S. America such as the Inca who were slaughtered and massacred by the Spanish, African tribes such as those in the Congo, laughtered and taken over by the Belgians.
Read your history books.
Who knows, perhaps one day it'll happen in Britain due to being overrun by foreign migrants.

Did not say who did the beatings, most were carried out by "natives" employed by the British. In the last war British prisoners of the Japs were treated with more cruelty by the guards who were Korean.
Prisoners in Germany had Ukranian and Romanian guards who were very sadistic. Same thing in Kenya.

nicko wrote:Did not say who did the beatings,   most were carried out by "natives" employed by the British.  In the last war British prisoners of the Japs were treated with more cruelty by the guards who were Korean.
Prisoners in Germany  had Ukranian and Romanian guards who were very sadistic.    Same thing in Kenya.

You really are coming out with some of the worst apologist nonsense I have ever heard Nicko

Crimes were committed based off British policies and acts committed by soldiers.

I will always defend when people are wrongly cast, as you have been for just being a soldier, but the actions of the British soldiers in Kenya, was appalling.

There is no defense for this and even worse you try to cast blame now on some Kenyans who were commissioned by the British and ordered by British officers. Let alone the British soldiers that committed murders and beatings themselves. As seen in some villages all the children died.

OK, we'll agree to disagree on that one.

Thorin wrote:

nicko wrote:Did not say who did the beatings,   most were carried out by "natives" employed by the British.  In the last war British prisoners of the Japs were treated with more cruelty by the guards who were Korean.
Prisoners in Germany  had Ukranian and Romanian guards who were very sadistic.    Same thing in Kenya.

You really are coming out with some of the worst apologist nonsense I have ever heard Nicko

Crimes were committed based off British policies and acts committed by soldiers.

I will always defend when people are wrongly cast, as you have been for just being a soldier, but the actions of the British soldiers in Kenya, was appalling.

There is no defense for this and even worse you try to cast blame now on some Kenyans who were commissioned by the British and ordered by British officers. Let alone the British soldiers that committed murders and beatings themselves. As seen in some villages all the children died.

I don't think Nicko is being apologist. I think what you two are demonstrating is the difference between what we have SEEN and what we have READ.

Miffs2 wrote:

Thorin wrote:


You really are coming out with some of the worst apologist nonsense I have ever heard Nicko

Crimes were committed based off British policies and acts committed by soldiers.

I will always defend when people are wrongly cast, as you have been for just being a soldier, but the actions of the British soldiers in Kenya, was appalling.

There is no defense for this and even worse you try to cast blame now on some Kenyans who were commissioned by the British and ordered by British officers. Let alone the British soldiers that committed murders and beatings themselves. As seen in some villages all the children died.

I don't think Nicko is being apologist. I think what you two are demonstrating is the difference between what we have SEEN and what we have READ.

So Nicko saw everything daily in all concentration camps and all enclosed villages all at the same time?
That is a neat trick Nems, how did he manage to be in a thousands of places all at the same time?
I have not discounted the atrocities by the Mau Mau, which I came to learn through research. The same with the British atrocities. So he is being an apologist by attempting to downplay any crimes, by claiming that they were only carried out by Kenyans troops employed by the British. Ignoring they had British officers who gave orders.. Ignoring British Soldiers known to have committed war crimes. Ignoring concentration camps, that led to thousands dying. Many historians have also researched this, of which anyone can follow up their findings. If your argument is that someone has not researched, surely then they should do so?

Do you deny the atrocities Nems?

If not, I fail to see what point you are making. As your point is like a German soldier who never witnessed any of the Holocaust, (of which some never did) but then later after the event, denying any Jews were murdered.

nicko wrote:OK,  we'll agree to disagree on that one.

Okay Nicko

Thorin wrote:

Miffs2 wrote:

I don't think Nicko is being apologist. I think what you two are demonstrating is the difference between what we have SEEN and what we have READ.

So Nicko saw everything daily in all concentration camps and all enclosed villages all at the same time?
That is a neat trick Nems, how did he manage to be in a thousands of places all at the same time?
I have not discounted the atrocities by the Mau Mau, which I came to learn through research. The same with the British atrocities. So he is being an apologist by attempting to downplay any crimes, by claiming that they were only carried out by Kenyans troops employed by the British. Ignoring they had British officers who gave orders.. Ignoring British Soldiers known to have committed war crimes. Ignoring concentration camps, that led to thousands dying. Many historians have also researched this, of which anyone can follow up their findings. If your argument is that someone has not researched, surely then they should do so?

Do you deny the atrocities Nems?

If not, I fail to see what point you are making. As your point is like a German soldier who never witnessed any of the Holocaust, (of which some never did) but then later after the event, denying any Jews were murdered.

I didn't say he had seen everything. He was commenting on what he had seen. Which was my point. I'm sorry you missed it.

Miffs2 wrote:

Thorin wrote:


So Nicko saw everything daily in all concentration camps and all enclosed villages all at the same time?
That is a neat trick Nems, how did he manage to be in a thousands of places all at the same time?
I have not discounted the atrocities by the Mau Mau, which I came to learn through research. The same with the British atrocities. So he is being an apologist by attempting to downplay any crimes, by claiming that they were only carried out by Kenyans troops employed by the British. Ignoring they had British officers who gave orders.. Ignoring British Soldiers known to have committed war crimes. Ignoring concentration camps, that led to thousands dying. Many historians have also researched this, of which anyone can follow up their findings. If your argument is that someone has not researched, surely then they should do so?

Do you deny the atrocities Nems?

If not, I fail to see what point you are making. As your point is like a German soldier who never witnessed any of the Holocaust, (of which some never did) but then later after the event, denying any Jews were murdered.

I didn't say he had seen everything. He was commenting on what he had seen. Which was my point. I'm sorry you missed it.

So if you do not witness something, does that mean it did not happen then?

Hence my point. Your point is like a German soldier who never witnessed any of the Holocaust, (of which some never did) but then later after the event, denying any Jews were murdered.

He made more than just comment on what he had seen and downplayed the crimes made by the British.

That is being an apologist

Thorin wrote:

Miffs2 wrote:



I didn't say he had seen everything. He was commenting on what he had seen. Which was my point. I'm sorry you missed it.

So if you do not witness something, does that mean it did not happen then?

Hence my point. Your point is like a German soldier who never witnessed any of the Holocaust, (of which some never did) but then later after the event, denying any Jews were murdered.

He made more than just comment on what he had seen and downplayed the crimes made by the British.

That is being an apologist

How is commenting on what you have seen being an apologist? You need to stop using words you don't comprehend.

Miffs2 wrote:

Thorin wrote:

So if you do not witness something, does that mean it did not happen then?

Hence my point. Your point is like a German soldier who never witnessed any of the Holocaust, (of which some never did) but then later after the event, denying any Jews were murdered.

He made more than just comment on what he had seen and downplayed the crimes made by the British.

That is being an apologist

How is commenting on what you have seen being an apologist? You need to stop using words you don't comprehend.

You need to actually read the entire thread to see how in error you are.

Maybe you need to learn to think before opening your gob

Thorin wrote:

Miffs2 wrote:

How is commenting on what you have seen being an apologist? You need to stop using words you don't comprehend.

You need to actually read the entire thread to see how in error you are.

Maybe you need to learn to think before opening your gob

My goodness, you are an ignorant little man.

nicko wrote:Did not say who did the beatings,   most were carried out by "natives" employed by the British.  In the last war British prisoners of the Japs were treated with more cruelty by the guards who were Korean.
Prisoners in Germany  had Ukranian and Romanian guards who were very sadistic.    Same thing in Kenya.

I bumped the above to show why Nems, has the intellect of a Gerbal.

The above shows Nicko trying trying to palm off any wrongs done by the British on natives.
Thus being an apologist when the order to place thousands in concentration camps and enclosed villages was done by the British, which would be their orders to beat and allow many to starve to death.

Hope this helps proves that like I say, that Nems needs to learn to think before jumping in with her big gob

Thorin wrote:

nicko wrote:Did not say who did the beatings,   most were carried out by "natives" employed by the British.  In the last war British prisoners of the Japs were treated with more cruelty by the guards who were Korean.
Prisoners in Germany  had Ukranian and Romanian guards who were very sadistic.    Same thing in Kenya.

I bumped the above to show why Nems, has the intellect of a Gerbal.

The above shows Nicko trying trying to palm off any wrongs done by the British on natives.
Thus being an apologist when the order to place thousands in concentration camps and enclosed villages was done by the British, was would be their orders to beat and allow many to starve to death.

Hope this helps proves that like I say, that Nems needs to learn to think before jumping in with her big gob

Nicko doesn't need me to speak for him but I didn't read his posts as apologist for anything. That's my opinion I'm entitled to hold it and to post it. You are still a nasty piece of work, read a million books, you will still be a thug.

Miffs2 wrote:

Thorin wrote:

I bumped the above to show why Nems, has the intellect of a Gerbal.

The above shows Nicko trying trying to palm off any wrongs done by the British on natives.
Thus being an apologist when the order to place thousands in concentration camps and enclosed villages was done by the British, was would be their orders to beat and allow many to starve to death.

Hope this helps proves that like I say, that Nems needs to learn to think before jumping in with her big gob

Nicko doesn't need me to speak for him but I didn't read his posts as apologist for anything. That's my opinion I'm entitled to hold it and to post it. You are still a nasty piece of work, read a million books, you will still be a thug.

You are entitled to be dumb in understanding what an apologist is.
As I just eloquently just proved.
So you think i am a thug. Whoopdeedo

Not prying to "palm" anything off, just stated what I knew, and as far as I know, no British Soldier nailed a white baby to a door post,witch is what some Mau Mau did. Not surprised some Brit Soldiers "lost it".

nicko wrote:Not prying to "palm" anything off,  just stated what I knew, and as far as I know, no British Soldier nailed a white baby to a door post,witch is what some Mau Mau  did. Not surprised some Brit Soldiers "lost it".

So you again make poor excuses for atrocities and concentration camps, making you again an apologist.

25,000 children died due to the concentration camps and enclosed villages

What crime did they commit Nicko for you to justify their deaths?

32 white settlers were murdered by the Mau Mau

I repeat, you have your opinion I have mine ! End of.

nicko wrote:I repeat, you have your opinion I have mine !    End of.

And I repeat, the British committed war crimes, which throughout you have refused to condemn. Where instead you offered poor excuses to.

You'll be defending the VC and IRA next, And I say that in a joking way !

nicko wrote:You'll be defending the VC and IRA next,   And I say that in a joking way !

Is that why I have condemned the Mau Mau on here already?

So you are suggesting that innocent children were justified deaths, 25,000 of them based off 32 white settlers murdered?

wow.
I have never defended the IRA, VC or the Mau Mau. Nor have I defended them here.

Are you suggesting the children were all terrorists?

Far more Kenyans were the victims of the Mau Mau.

OH for fucks sake give it a rest, i'm in the wrong, I admit it, happy now?