Three dead in Maryland mall shooting

Ben_Reilly wrote:These are just the gun deaths that make the news, Cass. Sadly, there are many shootings every day in the U.S. that don't make headlines because it's just not that big a deal any more.

Over the course of one calendar year since the Sandy Hook massacre, there were about 32,000 shooting deaths in the U.S., almost 90 per day.

Joy Division wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:These are just the gun deaths that make the news, Cass. Sadly, there are many shootings every day in the U.S. that don't make headlines because it's just not that big a deal any more.

Over the course of one calendar year since the Sandy Hook massacre, there were about 32,000 shooting deaths in the U.S., almost 90 per day.

Another reason not to legalise hand guns here, and as you rightly say Ben, that's just the shootings and fatalities we here of.  

BigAndy9 wrote:The gunman - well, he's evil and from what I've seen in my 40 years, evil criminals are the ones who seem to have no problem getting a gun - if they can't they'll just use a knife.

Then we have the poor victims - what do they have to protect themselves?  Nothing.

Ben_Reilly wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:The gunman - well, he's evil and from what I've seen in my 40 years, evil criminals are the ones who seem to have no problem getting a gun - if they can't they'll just use a knife.

Then we have the poor victims - what do they have to protect themselves?  Nothing.

It's a lot harder to carry off a mass killing spree with a knife, though. A few years ago a man in China went on a knifing spree, but all his victims survived.

Not that I'm arguing that the U.S. should or even could get rid of its guns -- it's in our constitution. But we put reasonable restrictions on rights all the time, and I don't think it's unreasonable to say that no civilian needs a gun that can be fired 33 times in half a minute without reloading, as was used in the shooting spree against Congresswoman Gabby Giffords in 2010. In fact, those high-capacity magazines have featured in at least half of the last 60-odd mass shootings we've had in the U.S.

BigAndy9 wrote:Seriously - are your criminals so good that if guns were banned they'd say "oh, I can't have one of those, they are illegal".

They're not like that over here, Sunshine.

lol

Ben_Reilly wrote:These are just the gun deaths that make the news, Cass. Sadly, there are many shootings every day in the U.S. that don't make headlines because it's just not that big a deal any more.

Over the course of one calendar year since the Sandy Hook massacre, there were about 32,000 shooting deaths in the U.S., almost 90 per day.

Ben_Reilly wrote:There are a lot of myths floating around there about guns, a good part made up by the NRA and their brain-dead bots. Interesting reading:

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/01/pro-gun-myths-fact-check

BigAndy9 wrote:....................................................

It's a real buzz, emptying a magazine in just a few seconds Ben.

An even bigger buzz letting rip with one of these:

Cass wrote:Oh didge come on....2 people are dead.
The perpetrator probably took his own life.
Its outrageous and ugly and horrific.

For the record I do think that there needs to be much stricter gun laws no high capacity clips etc etc....but I do believe that people have the right to protect themselves and their homes even though the 2nd amendment was written in a different time and situation for a different set of circumstances.

If people want a hunting rifle and /or handgun then fine - anything more than that is not necessary. I personally don't own any but we have thought about it and also have a home security system.

Is everyone who owns a gun bad or crazy? Of course not. Are there some gun owners who scare the crap out of me? Absolutely. Sadly lobbyist control too much in DC at the moment - not just in guns - but I ask myself how many more dead people will it take to make people see some God damn common sense about this? The answer is I don't know and that is unbelievably tragic and Scary as hell.

PhilDidge wrote:
So if people lived off the land without firearms in the past why are they needed today in remote areas, when previous methods were effective in hunting?

ALLAKAKA wrote:You can hardly class a person who LEGALLY used a handgun at a Shooting Club and kept that firearm at home in a LOCKED gun safe, a threat to the public.

PhilDidge wrote:

ALLAKAKA wrote:You can hardly class a person who LEGALLY used a handgun at a Shooting Club and kept that firearm at home in a LOCKED gun safe, a threat to the public.

Never claimed that, my view is why they do?

There are plenty of non-lethal guns are there not?

ALLAKAKA wrote:

PhilDidge wrote:


Never claimed that, my view is why they do?

There are plenty of non-lethal guns are there not?

MARKSMANSHIP, simply a sport as any other sport such as Darts.

PhilDidge wrote:

ALLAKAKA wrote:


MARKSMANSHIP, simply a sport as any other sport such as Darts.

So you are saying you cannot be a marksman with non lethal guns now?

ALLAKAKA wrote:

PhilDidge wrote:

So you are saying you cannot be a marksman with non lethal guns now?

Just as you cannot be a craftsman without the appropriate tools.

PhilDidge wrote:

ALLAKAKA wrote:



Just as you cannot be a craftsman without the appropriate tools.

That never answered my question:

Try again

So you are saying you cannot be a marksman with non lethal guns now?

PhilDidge wrote:
Not concerned why they do, I asked a very simple question, which your reasoning seems to be down to being efficient, humane, really?

So how was ancient methods not humane or efficient before the advent of the gun?

Beekeeper wrote:

PhilDidge wrote:
Not concerned why they do, I asked a very simple question, which your reasoning seems to be down to being efficient, humane, really?

So how was ancient methods not humane or efficient before the advent of the gun?

  

Spearing and clubbing an animal to death over several minutes or half an hour isn't my idea of humane.

Even worse when that animal may have been run down or corralled before being executed..

The use of snares, pits or traps means that the prey could be suffering for hours or even days before the hunter returns to finally kill that animal..

NOT exactly effective nor efficient in those cases...

Proper use of firearms by trained and qualified users DOES give quicker, kinder and more effective means of killing food animals, vermin or larger pests, or putting down injured animals when lethal and sedative/humane poisons aren't available.

HAVE you ever attempted to slit an animals throat, Didge, or tried to club an animal to death, or broken a rabbit's or poultry's necks ~ after all, they ARE the traditional means of slaughtering food animals..     

Ben_Reilly wrote:Cass, you were in Texas? I'm in Texas! Where did you stay, if you don't mind me asking?

Bee, I really hope that's all they ever let Andy use that gun for. I'd like to say I can't think of a person I'd less like in control of that level of lethality ... unfortunately, I can ...

Cass wrote:Didge I understand what you are saying.....some of the laws are very absurd - see my earlier reply to ben but banning them all will never happen - going back to the old cliche that you might as well ban anything that could be a potential weapon like knives, cars, baseball bats......anything when used with evil intent can be turned into a weapon - even a human fist.
Sorry again I disagree me Lady, many things can kill that does not mean okay if one can kill, yet it has many other purposes we should not ban one that's real use is solely to kill.

What needs to happen is far stricter laws, background investigations, no access to high capacity clips, no concealed weapons permit, mandatory training and banning of private owner use of anything beyond handgun or hunting rifle. There is no need whatsoever for anyone not in law enforcement or military to own assault weapons such as an AR-15.
I think there should be laws banning all the only use being for the armed forces, it is absurd to me that we have laws allowing guns within society

Some dickhead of a person who is running for Senate said on Friday that he will give away an AR-15 to a lucky supporter of his campaign because according to him "its no secret that the democrats and liberal media would love to take away our guns and mandate every aspect of our lives". Its people like him who are the problem.

Cass wrote:Again good points you raise. I suppose I grew up over here so it was accepted. My dad used to go hunting duck and deer and yes we ate it (which explains my aversion to venison but not my liking for shredded duck? Go figure).

Mr. C and the boys still get amazed when they see someone openly carry because it just wasn't there in the UK.

Do I like it? No
Do I want to own one? Complicated but I veer towards no - have used a few at army wives things but I didn't really like it.
Do I wish it was different?  Yes but I have to be realistic

So lets agree to disagree.
must go raise the dead aka dragging junior from his pit as I have bribed him with breakfast at our favorite diner in return for helping me with shopping as as certain someone is off playing golf.
xxxx

Cass wrote:Again good points you raise. I suppose I grew up over here so it was accepted. My dad used to go hunting duck and deer and yes we ate it (which explains my aversion to venison but not my liking for shredded duck? Go figure).

Mr. C and the boys still get amazed when they see someone openly carry because it just wasn't there in the UK.

Do I like it? No
Do I want to own one? Complicated but I veer towards no - have used a few at army wives things but I didn't really like it.
Do I wish it was different?  Yes but I have to be realistic

So lets agree to disagree.
must go raise the dead aka dragging junior from his pit as I have bribed him with breakfast at our favorite diner in return for helping me with shopping as as certain someone is off playing golf.
xxxx

Ben_Reilly wrote:Oh my, Texas Roadhouse. I've never been to one but I have the feeling I'd like it about as much as Australians love Outback Steakhouse