Benefit cuts blind man committed suicide after Atos ruled him fit to work

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:45 pm

Desperate: Tim Salter killed himself after his benefits were slashed following an Atos fitness to work test
A depressed blind man killed himself after he was left penniless because his benefits were slashed, an inquest heard

Desperate Tim Salter struggled to even feed himself when controversial private firm Atos ruled he was fit for work, despite his failing eyesight.

The 53-year-old, who also suffered agoraphobia, was about to be kicked out of his housing association home when he hanged himself in the hall.

A coroner ruled the Government’s decision to axe Tim’s meagre incapacity benefit contributed to his death.

And the former assistant store manager’s sister Linda Cooksey told how his fitness to work test was carried out by a physiotherapist with no experience of mental health issues or knowledge of his blindness.

Benefit cuts blind man committed suicide after Atos ruled him fit to work Linda-Cooksey-2964857

Benefit cuts blind man committed suicide after Atos ruled him fit to work Linda-Cooksey-2964857

Sister: Linda Cooksey
Jon Fuller Rowell/ Daily Mirror
The 60-year-old said his family never even knew about his money problems until after his death.

She added: “Stopping his benefits sent him over the edge. When his small savings ran out he got in trouble with his rent, and his £30 disability allowance a week just wasn’t enough.

"Tim ran out of money. He was a proud man and never let on to anybody. It’s so sad. I want everyone to know what this government is doing to vulnerable people on benefits.

“He had a certificate to say he was blind. When we got into his house there was no food, he practically starved in the last weeks.”

Daily Mirror e-edition: How to get yours for FREE

South Staffordshire coroner Andrew Haigh said: “A major factor in his death was that his benefits had been greatly reduced leaving him almost destitute.”

Tim died on September 25.

An eviction letter from South Staffordshire Housing Association was found in the bin by his family.

He was registered partially-blind in 1994. His eyes were damaged when he tried to kill himself in 1989 after losing his job.

His family has written to David Cameron about his Atos treatment.

The housing association insisted help was available for those struggling to pay rent.

And the Department for Work and Pensions said Tim had the right to appeal its decision.

Verdict: Suicide.

Check out all the latest News, Sport & Celeb gossip at Mirror.co.uk http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/benefit-cuts-blind-man-committed-2965375#ixzz2onS7q4oI
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Twisted Evil

Bastards serving a Twisted Evil

Evil RW coalition government.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:48 pm

...that is absolutely awful and not the first case of suicide because of OTT austerity measure and picking on the disabled , expecting folk barely able to stand up , or who are even nearing the end of life to work and carry put impossible tasks.

Disgusting filthy RW policies of pick on the vulnerable , sick and poor.

by Ben Reilly Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:49 pm

Just goes to show that companies can't be allowed to police themselves. They always leave corpses in their wake when that happens.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:51 pm

Disgusting Benefit cuts blind man committed suicide after Atos ruled him fit to work Smile107

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:55 pm

Joy Division wrote:...that is absolutely awful and not the first case of suicide because of OTT austerity measure and picking on the disabled , expecting folk barely able to stand up , or who are even nearing the end of life to work and carry put impossible tasks.

Disgusting filthy RW policies of pick on the vulnerable , sick and poor.

They are finding the terminally ill fit for work as well..Nothing more than murderous scum imo..ATOS and disgusting filthy RW scum government. Twisted Evil

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 7:55 pm

Bloody disgraceful !!

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 7:58 pm

Oh dear, don't you mean he didn't manage his money properly?

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 8:41 pm

Sassy wrote:Oh dear, don't you mean he didn't manage his money properly?

That what some RW idiots will say on here, love to here what one in particular makes of this case.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 9:09 pm

Sassy wrote:Oh dear, don't you mean he didn't manage his money properly?

...I know, that's the bloody ignorant and pathetic excuses we constantly hear bleated about managing money...blame it on the poor person despite there being not enough work to go around , with a government hell bent on axing jobs and not creating them.

Cuts are needed , but not when it they cut lives much shorter.

Blame the guy who killed himself as he had a bleak outlook, low prospects and not enough money coming in to manage sufficiently from, then cut this blind man's income when he is already struggling.

Absolutely disgusting....and it's happening under this RW run farce coalition.

by Irn Bru Sat Dec 28, 2013 9:59 pm

Absolutely shocking and I see the coroner ruled the Government’s decision to axe Tim’s meagre incapacity benefit contributed to his death.

Shameless gits.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:03 pm

K

Irn Bru wrote:Absolutely shocking and I see the coroner ruled the Government’s decision to axe Tim’s meagre incapacity benefit contributed to his death.

Shameless gits.

... I know Irn, bloody filthy scumbags.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:11 pm

...and so much for George Osborne's 'we will help the people who need it most'.

This one rally tugs at the heart.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:13 pm

I'd be tugging at IDS's throat given half a chance.

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:33 pm

If the revolution ever comes i would suspect that ATOS buildings will be one of the first in the firing line and some of the cunts that work in them.

by Ben Reilly Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:37 pm

You know, I saw a comment on another site that I found rather thought-provoking. At least I think it wasn't here.

To paraphrase, the commenter said, "I used to think the French and the Russians went way overboard when they revolted against the wealthy historically, with their executions. But when you look at how the wealthy act today and what they say about the poor, it sort of helps you understand where those revolutionaries were coming from."

by Guest Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:41 pm

Sassy wrote:I'd be tugging at IDS's throat given half a chance.

, but seriously Sassy, I feel the same.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:05 am

Ben_Reilly wrote:You know, I saw a comment on another site that I found rather thought-provoking. At least I think it wasn't here.

To paraphrase, the commenter said, "I used to think the French and the Russians went way overboard when they revolted against the wealthy historically, with their executions. But when you look at how the wealthy act today and what they say about the poor, it sort of helps you understand where those revolutionaries were coming from."

Well, I'd join in lol

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:48 am

Chances are he wouldn't have been "kicked out of his housing association home".

Sensationalist writing, with an agenda, of course.

Terribly sad story indeed, it's clear the poor man had lots of problems - suicide is not the way to go - there is so much help out there for people like him.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:50 am

I see people are using the plight of a suicide to now make a political statement, when this person already had mental health issues, but the point is here, was there any reason he could not work?
Yes it is very sad he has taken his own life and this was not the first time he has tried to do so, but lets face some home truths here, was his eyesight good enough for him to do many daily chores like shopping etc, as I see no reference to having carers, which would indicate to me he had enough vision in his eyes.

This is nothing to do with as Ben is claiming having a go at the poor, this is about whether people are fit an able to work and many people with disabilities can work, so yes it is a shame and tragedy that he has taken his life, but from someone who has been suicidal before, who was also to proud to seek help from his own family, a sad story but I have yet to see if the ruling made for him to be fit to work was wrong and if he was fit to work then why should his benefits continue?

You may think I am being harsh because he has killed himself, but lets face realities here, is the argument here we should not stop anyone's benefits in case they might kill themselves? Nobody can predict that happening. So if the decision was wrong yes this should be taken up by the family to sue, but I did not see that either, so was the decision wrong here?

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:35 pm

PhilDidge wrote:I see people are using the plight of a suicide to now make a political statement, when this person already had mental health issues, but the point is here, was there any reason he could not work?
Yes it is very sad he has taken his own life and this was not the first time he has tried to do so, but lets face some home truths here, was his eyesight good enough for him to do many daily chores like shopping etc, as I see no reference to having carers, which would indicate to me he had enough vision in his eyes.

This is nothing to do with as Ben is claiming having a go at the poor, this is about whether people are fit an able to work and many people with disabilities can work, so yes it is a shame and tragedy that he has taken his life, but from someone who has been suicidal before, who was also to proud to seek help from his own family, a sad story but I have yet to see if the ruling made for him to be fit to work was wrong and if he was fit to work then why should his benefits continue?

You may think I am being harsh because he has killed himself, but lets face realities here, is the argument here we should not stop anyone's benefits in case they might kill themselves? Nobody can predict that happening. So if the decision was wrong yes this should be taken up by the family to sue, but I did not see that either, so was the decision wrong here?

How can someone with agroaphobia, failing eyesight and with underline mental health issues including documented previous suicide attempts be fit for work you idiot, this murderous RW coalition has cut access to carers, you don't seem to want to acknowledge that services are being cut you cap doffer.

He got into such a state and was probably waiting for his appeal to be heard and that takes a year and in the meantime he was being required to exist on £70 for food and bills which is impossible without getting into debt which led to the eviction notice and they do enforce eviction notices despite what another RW idiot has said on this thread.

The cretin ATOS monkey that made the decision should be sacked for a start and then this awful RW shit of a company should be kicked out of this country and sent back to France.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:53 pm

Catman wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:I see people are using the plight of a suicide to now make a political statement, when this person already had mental health issues, but the point is here, was there any reason he could not work?
Yes it is very sad he has taken his own life and this was not the first time he has tried to do so, but lets face some home truths here, was his eyesight good enough for him to do many daily chores like shopping etc, as I see no reference to having carers, which would indicate to me he had enough vision in his eyes.

This is nothing to do with as Ben is claiming having a go at the poor, this is about whether people are fit an able to work and many people with disabilities can work, so yes it is a shame and tragedy that he has taken his life, but from someone who has been suicidal before, who was also to proud to seek help from his own family, a sad story but I have yet to see if the ruling made for him to be fit to work was wrong and if he was fit to work then why should his benefits continue?

You may think I am being harsh because he has killed himself, but lets face realities here, is the argument here we should not stop anyone's benefits in case they might kill themselves? Nobody can predict that happening. So if the decision was wrong yes this should be taken up by the family to sue, but I did not see that either, so was the decision wrong here?

How can someone with agroaphobia, failing eyesight and with underline mental health issues including documented previous suicide attempts be fit for work you idiot, this murderous RW coalition has cut access to carers, you don't seem to want to acknowledge that services are being cut you cap doffer.
Easily, as has anyone provided evidence that he should not? This is why arguments over guilt are poor to say the least, they miss if there is a case in the first place of which I have seen no evidence to say otherwise.

He got into such a state and was probably waiting for his appeal to be heard and that takes a year and in the meantime he was being required to exist on £70 for food and bills which is impossible without getting into debt which led to the eviction notice and they do enforce eviction notices despite what another RW idiot has said on this thread.
Yes he did get into a state as some people react different to any given problem, and this situation made him react, it does not mean this is the norm or far from it but rare event and you are allowing anger to cloud your judgement with poor woeful insults as per usual. The fact is if he is fit to work, what were they meant to do, still fund benefits to someone that can work? I see no evidence to state he could not work, if there is evidence and it is presented then I will happily say this was wrong, but none is forth coming. It is easy afterwards to claim something based upon a persons condition, when as seen we only have the side of the story given by the Mirror.

The cretin ATOS monkey that made the decision should be sacked for a start and then this awful RW shit of a company should be kicked out of this country and sent back to France.

Why should they be sacked if the decision was correct, I have seen no person in a medical position state otherwise in the article, did you? The system is not perfect and again needs some work done on this, but the issue here is on whether it was the right decision and even then people can make mistakes, as plenty of GP's do each year with wrong diagnoses

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:18 pm

[quote="PhilDidge"]

Catman wrote:

How can someone with agroaphobia, failing eyesight and with underline mental health issues including documented previous suicide attempts be fit for work you idiot, this murderous RW coalition has cut access to carers, you don't seem to want to acknowledge that services are being cut you cap doffer.
Easily, as has anyone provided evidence that he should not? This is why arguments over guilt are poor to say the least, they miss if there is a case in the first place of which I have seen no evidence to say otherwise.

For a start agorophobia means you can't leave the flat or house so how could he be fit to attend a job then idiot.
A GP would have provided medical certificates and a GP knows better than an ATOS monkey cap doffer

He got into such a state and was probably waiting for his appeal to be heard and that takes a year and in the meantime he was being required to exist on £70 for food and bills which is impossible without getting into debt which led to the eviction notice and they do enforce eviction notices despite what another RW idiot has said on this thread.
Yes he did get into a state as some people react different to any given problem, and this situation made him react, it does not mean this is the norm or far from it but rare event and you are allowing anger to cloud your judgement with poor woeful insults as per usual. The fact is if he is fit to work, what were they meant to do, still fund benefits to someone that can work? I see no evidence to state he could not work, if there is evidence and it is presented then I will happily say this was wrong, but none is forth coming. It is easy afterwards to claim something based upon a persons condition, when as seen we only have the side of the story given by the Mirror.

People with agoraphobia react in the same way, it's a well known medical condition you idiot.
The fact that the majority of people win their cases on appeal shows that ATOS monkeys know nothing and the system isn't fit for purpose

Why should they be sacked if the decision was correct, I have seen no person in a medical position state otherwise in the article, did you? The system is not perfect and again needs some work done on this, but the issue here is on whether it was the right decision and even then people can make mistakes, as plenty of GP's do each year with wrong diagnoses

The decision was not correct and was made by an ATOS monkey using a points scoring system on a computer, that isn't advanced enough to be able to consider mental health issues.
The GP knows better than the ATOS monkey and a computer points scoring system and GP's do not make as many wrong diagnosis as these cunts keep doing as the appeals process has shown you ignorant RW imbecile.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:19 pm

Again, its the vulnerable that suffer the most.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:24 pm

NemsAgain wrote:Again, its the vulnerable that suffer the most.

To some degree, I agree.

They haven't suffered the most financially though - that will usually be those in the middle - the workers who earn £20,000 - £40,000.

But it makes sense - it's in the word - vulnerable - that's nobody elses fault, they are "vulnerable" after all.

I wonder what his family did to help, or are they lefties too and were quite happy he died, like the Mirror and its supporters on here?

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:25 pm

Catman wrote:

For a start agorophobia means you can't leave the flat or house so how could he be fit to attend a job then idiot.
A GP would have provided medical certificates and a GP knows better than an ATOS monkey cap doffer

Yet needed no carers to help him shop and do others things daily, so again where is the evidence that he was never able to leave his house?
Sorry anger is clouding your judgement again

People with agoraphobia react in the same way, it's a well known medical condition you idiot.
The fact that the majority of people win their cases on appeal shows that ATOS monkeys know nothing and the system isn't fit for purpose

Again you are no medical expert and are presuming how bad his condition was with agoraphobia of which there are varying levels. The fact that some people win on appeals shows the system does work where a mistake happens it is rectified, but here with this case I see no evidence to state it was the wrong decision

The decision was not correct and was made by an ATOS monkey using a points scoring system on a computer, that isn't advanced enough to be able to consider mental health issues.
The GP knows better than the ATOS monkey and a computer points scoring system and GP's do not make as many wrong diagnosis as these cunts keep doing as the appeals process has shown you ignorant RW imbecile.

[/quote]

Really, then you should be able to present expert opinion to state otherwise and very nice to cast people in such a way that are just doing their job. GP's make mistakes and ye they know more, but what you have failed to show me is a GP state he should not have been working. Your argument is what happens when people get angry, they never think clearly and react to the story but do not delve further into to see if the reality was that he could work. I am pointing this out to you because you have judged something based on the article. It could well be the case the decision was wrong and as stated would be happy to say if that was the case, but as there is no evidence other than to presume he could not based on certain conditions which vary greatly in people is naive to say the least

Right off to the footie

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:34 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
Catman wrote:

For a start agorophobia means you can't leave the flat or house so how could he be fit to attend a job then idiot.
A GP would have provided medical certificates and a GP knows better than an ATOS monkey cap doffer

Yet needed no carers to help him shop and do others things daily, so again where is the evidence that he was never able to leave his house?
Sorry anger is clouding your judgement again

What part of carers services have been cut don't you understand you idiot.
Agoraphobia is an illness where you can't get out as diagnosed by his GP moron.

People with agoraphobia react in the same way, it's a well known medical condition you idiot.
The fact that the majority of people win their cases on appeal shows that ATOS monkeys know nothing and the system isn't fit for purpose

Again you are no medical expert and are presuming how bad his condition was with agoraphobia of which there are varying levels. The fact that some people win on appeals shows the system does work where a mistake happens it is rectified, but here with this case I see no evidence to state it was the wrong decision

Again look up agoraphobia..Try google you moron

The decision was not correct and was made by an ATOS monkey using a points scoring system on a computer, that isn't advanced enough to be able to consider mental health issues.
The GP knows better than the ATOS monkey and a computer points scoring system and GP's do not make as many wrong diagnosis as these cunts keep doing as the appeals process has shown you ignorant RW imbecile.

Really, then you should be able to present expert opinion to state otherwise and very nice to cast people in such a way that are just doing their job. GP's make mistakes and ye they know more, but what you have failed to show me is a GP state he should not have been working. Your argument is what happens when people get angry, they never think clearly and react to the story but do not delve further into to see if the reality was that he could work. I am pointing this out to you because you have judged something based on the article. It could well be the case the decision was wrong and as stated would be happy to say if that was the case, but as there is no evidence other than to presume he could not based on certain conditions which vary greatly in people is naive to say the least

GP made the decision originally which was why he was put on incapacity benefit in the first place, again that expert decision was made by an expert and not an ATOS monkey.
We don't need a profit making company in this country making decisions relating to their profits.
We need a return to the GP deciding whether people are fit for work or not

Right off to the footie [/quote]

Hope the team that you support get thrashed. Razz

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:00 pm

A couple of very good posts there by CATMAN, can't quote on them as it's not letting me but your absolutely right Phil, some people should just stop blaming the computer for his points score ,me hen all along they knew he was blind and had recent suited attempts....

Wtf is wrong with people ?, someone trying suicide is not thinking rationally, let alone hold down a job ...and without sight,

Beggars belief this lot who pick on poor blokes like this guy....

Anyway, great posts Phil Smile

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:02 pm

..one can be dying and Atos will mark then fit for work...it should be left to that patients GP to decide as you mention Phil...

More common sense! Smile

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:04 pm

Joy Division wrote:A couple of very good posts there by CATMAN, can't quote on them as it's not letting me but your absolutely right Phil, some people should just stop blaming the computer for his points score ,me hen all along they knew he was blind and had recent suited attempts....

Wtf is wrong with people ?, someone trying suicide is not thinking rationally, let alone hold down a job ...and without sight,

Beggars belief this lot who pick on poor blokes like this guy....

Anyway, great posts Phil

They are just trying to brush it all under the carpet JD, they don't give a damn and what we are seeing is a modern day holocaust against the poor, sick, elderly and vulnerable Twisted Evil

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:31 pm

Joy Division wrote:A couple of very good posts there by CATMAN, can't quote on them as it's not letting me but your absolutely right Phil, some people should just stop blaming the computer for his points score ,me hen all along they knew he was blind and had recent suited attempts....

Wtf is wrong with people ?, someone trying suicide is not thinking rationally, let alone hold down a job ...and without sight,

Beggars belief this lot who pick on poor blokes like this guy....

Anyway, great posts Phil

Hilarious, good points based on no medical expertise, of course they are posts based on emotions and not any rational thing Joy, that is why arguments on guilt are always poor to say the least, again where is the evidence it was a wrong decision?

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:33 pm

Joy Division wrote:..one can be dying and Atos will mark then fit for work...it should be left to that patients GP to decide as you mention Phil...

More common sense!

GP's diagnose with wrong decisions, this is life just as mistakes can happen with looking to see if people are able to work, would you rather there was no system and people abused the system Joy ?

You lefties really play off the back of guilt when we do not even have the full story here but by design an article very much like the Dail Mail that plays to emotions

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:37 pm

It was ATOS who had no medical experties with regard to this man, a physiotherapist who knew about blindness and mental health? A man who as said, was certified as blind.

The coroner gave the evidence of a wrong decision by ATOS.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:48 pm

Sassy wrote:It was ATOS who had no medical experties with regard to this man, a physiotherapist who knew about blindness and mental health? A man who as said, was certified as blind.

The coroner gave the evidence of a wrong decision by ATOS.

Do you need to be an expert to see if someone can see things when asking questions.

The coroner never gave any such decision it was wrong, it said it played a part in him deciding to commit suicide, so that is a blatant lefty load of bollocks

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:54 pm

Only a complete fool would come out with that.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:57 pm

Really only a fool would say coroner could say whether he was fit to work or not when they are there to find the cause of death, yep you come out with all kinds of shit Stasi.

So again present the evidence that the coroner said it was the wrong decision?

Oh you cant, because you lied out of your arse as you usually do!

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:01 pm

Didge, didn't you at one point say you worked in the health service? And you come out with something about telling someone's blindness by whether they are looking at you or not?

A physiotherapist knows nothing about mental health problems, which is why mental health experts are appalled that they are doing checks on people with mental health issues.

The coroner works on evidence, the coroner is not allowed to say something he cannot back up. The coroner said that the loss of benefits contributed to his death, he lost his benefits because a physiotherapist tried to decide on mental health and blindness issues.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:01 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
Joy Division wrote:..one can be dying and Atos will mark then fit for work...it should be left to that patients GP to decide as you mention Phil...

More common sense!

GP's diagnose with wrong decisions, this is life just as mistakes can happen with looking to see if people are able to work, would you rather there was no system and people abused the system Joy ?

You lefties really play off the back of guilt when we do not even have the full story here but by design an article very much like the Dail Mail that plays to emotions

...that's just it Didge,it should be based UPON his GP's file of his a tail disabilities, not that stinking ATOS who have targets to meet for this lousy Tory led coalition.

That poor bloke along with many others are just a number to ATOS, despite him being blind and with other serious problems.

All his own fault was it a Didge?, despite his income being cut when it was not enough to live on properly In the first place.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:02 pm

Sassy wrote:Didge, didn't you at one point say you worked in the health service? And you come out with something about telling someone's blindness by whether they are looking at you or not?

A physiotherapist knows nothing about mental health problems, which is why mental health experts are appalled that they are doing checks on people with mental health issues.

The coroner works on evidence, the coroner is not allowed to say something he cannot back up. The coroner said that the loss of benefits contributed to his death.

...it's fallen on deaf ears again Sassy.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:03 pm

Gloop Joy, not worth the time.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:04 pm

Sassy wrote:Didge, didn't you at one point say you worked in the health service? And you come out with something about telling someone's blindness by whether they are looking at you or not?

A physiotherapist knows nothing about mental health problems, which is why mental health experts are appalled that they are doing checks on people with mental health issues.

The coroner works on evidence, the coroner is not allowed to say something he cannot back up. The coroner said that the loss of benefits contributed to his death.

Yes I used to work in the health service and you have no idea about mental health problems either and thus are playing up to an article biased to make out this was some poor decision which of yet, he was not declared as such, only an impression he has some is given.

So now you change your answer to the coroner saying the loss of benefits contributed to his death of which I have not denied, you claim that the coroner stated the ATOS decision was wrong, when that was a lie, so you admit you just told a big whopping lie then?

So evidence from the lefties by medical experts this was the wrong decision?

Zero

Have we only heard the events from one side of the story?

Yes

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:05 pm

Joy Division wrote:
Sassy wrote:Didge, didn't you at one point say you worked in the health service? And you come out with something about telling someone's blindness by whether they are looking at you or not?

A physiotherapist knows nothing about mental health problems, which is why mental health experts are appalled that they are doing checks on people with mental health issues.

The coroner works on evidence, the coroner is not allowed to say something he cannot back up. The coroner said that the loss of benefits contributed to his death.
...it's fallen on deaf ears again Sassy.

No as seen the left do not have an answer they rely on emotions when debating, quite sad really

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:15 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
Joy Division wrote:
...it's fallen on deaf ears again Sassy.

No as seen the left do not have an answer they rely on emotions when debating, quite sad really

You're the sad one, you repeat the same old brainwashed cap doffer hogwash shitty script over and over like some demented robot.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:21 pm

I happen to think that rage at injustice is a very good emotion to have. Those without it are the ones with a real problem and those that try to justify injustice have the biggest problem of the lot.

It is not the emotion that is the argument, it is the facts that cause the emotion. If you cannot feel the emotion when you see the facts, its really sad.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:26 pm

Rage is a good emotion? Really, rage leads to hate and violence, that has to be the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

The whole argument is on emotions, because emotions have allowed you to cloud any rational views you had, because as seen you now claims facts off the back of claims, that proves beyond doubt that emotions take away any sense and reasons you had

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:30 pm

Gloop Gloop and more Gloop

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:30 pm

PhilDidge wrote:Rage is a good emotion? Really, rage leads to hate and violence, that has to be the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

The whole argument is on emotions, because emotions have allowed you to cloud any rational views you had, because as seen you now claims facts off the back of claims, that proves beyond doubt that emotions take away any sense and reasons you had

I seem to remember that you had quite a lot of rage on the fox hunting thread which was eventually locked due to yours and other Rwhingers rage you stupid hypocrite.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:36 pm

Catman wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:Rage is a good emotion? Really, rage leads to hate and violence, that has to be the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

The whole argument is on emotions, because emotions have allowed you to cloud any rational views you had, because as seen you now claims facts off the back of claims, that proves beyond doubt that emotions take away any sense and reasons you had

I seem to remember that you had quite a lot of rage on the fox hunting thread which was eventually locked due to yours and other Rwhingers rage you stupid hypocrite.

That was rage and what does it achieve?
Nothing, I can admit that it does and when I do wrong, but my anger was at an imbecile posting poor accusations, when I could have just posted that he was simply an imbecile.
Rage is always wrong, even when I do it.

Is this all you lefties have to respond with?

://?roflmao?/:

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:37 pm

Rage, when channeled, is the emotion that gets most done. But it has to be channeled and controlled, and you have to never loose sight of the injustice that inspired it.

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:39 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
Catman wrote:

I seem to remember that you had quite a lot of rage on the fox hunting thread which was eventually locked due to yours and other Rwhingers rage you stupid hypocrite.

That was rage and what does it achieve?
Nothing, I can admit that it does and when I do wrong, but my anger was at an imbecile posting poor accusations, when I could have just posted that he was simply an imbecile.
Rage is always wrong, even when I do it.

Is this all you lefties have to respond with?

://?roflmao?/:

I would say that rage achieved a lot in getting rid of the poll tax...Remember those proud riots! cheers

by Guest Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:40 pm

If you don't feel rage against injustice, you let the machine roll over you and sit in your complacency letting anything be done.

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