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Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Mon Feb 01, 2016 6:50 pm
Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
07/12/2009 05:12 am ET | Updated Nov 17, 2011
Kathy Freston
Health and Wellness Activist, Author
Going through the comments of some of my recent posts, I noticed the frequently stated notion that eating meat was an essential step in human evolution. While this notion may comfort the meat industry, it's simply not true, scientifically.
Dr. T. Colin Campbell, professor emeritus at Cornell University and author of The China Study, explains that in fact, we only recently (historically speaking) began eating meat, and that the inclusion of meat in our diet came well after we became who we are today. He explains that "the birth of agriculture only started about 10,000 years ago at a time when it became considerably more convenient to herd animals. This is not nearly as long as the time [that] fashioned our basic biochemical functionality (at least tens of millions of years) and which functionality depends on the nutrient composition of plant-based foods."
That jibes with what Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine President Dr. Neal Barnard says in his book, The Power of Your Plate, in which he explains that "early humans had diets very much like other great apes, which is to say a largely plant-based diet, drawing on foods we can pick with our hands. Research suggests that meat-eating probably began by scavenging--eating the leftovers that carnivores had left behind. However, our bodies have never adapted to it. To this day, meat-eaters have a higher incidence of heart disease, cancer, diabetes, and other problems."
There is no more authoritative source on anthropological issues than paleontologist Dr. Richard Leakey, who explains what anyone who has taken an introductory physiology course might have discerned intuitively--that humans are herbivores. Leakey notes that "[y]ou can't tear flesh by hand, you can't tear hide by hand.... We wouldn't have been able to deal with food source that required those large canines" (although we have teeth that are called "canines," they bear little resemblance to the canines of carnivores).
In fact, our hands are perfect for grabbing and picking fruits and vegetables. Similarly, like the intestines of other herbivores, ours are very long (carnivores have short intestines so they can quickly get rid of all that rotting flesh they eat). We don't have sharp claws to seize and hold down prey. And most of us (hopefully) lack the instinct that would drive us to chase and then kill animals and devour their raw carcasses. Dr. Milton Mills builds on these points and offers dozens more in his essay, "A Comparative Anatomy of Eating."
The point is this: Thousands of years ago when we were hunter-gatherers, we may have needed a bit of meat in our diets in times of scarcity, but we don't need it now. Says Dr. William C. Roberts, editor of the American Journal of Cardiology, "Although we think we are, and we act as if we are, human beings are not natural carnivores. When we kill animals to eat them, they end up killing us, because their flesh, which contains cholesterol and saturated fat, was never intended for human beings, who are natural herbivores."
Sure, most of us are "behavioral omnivores"--that is, we eat meat, so that defines us as omnivorous. But our evolution and physiology are herbivorous, and ample science proves that when we choose to eat meat, that causes problems, from decreased energy and a need for more sleep up to increased risk for obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer.
Old habits die hard, and it's convenient for people who like to eat meat to think that there is evidence to support their belief that eating meat is "natural" or the cause of our evolution. For many years, I too, clung to the idea that meat and dairy were good for me; I realize now that I was probably comforted to have justification for my continued attachment to the traditions I grew up with.
But in fact top nutritional and anthropological scientists from the most reputable institutions imaginable say categorically that humans are natural herbivores, and that we will be healthier today if we stick with our herbivorous roots. It may be inconvenient, but it alas, it is the truth.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-freston/shattering-the-meat-myth_b_214390.html
07/12/2009 05:12 am ET | Updated Nov 17, 2011
Kathy Freston
Health and Wellness Activist, Author
Going through the comments of some of my recent posts, I noticed the frequently stated notion that eating meat was an essential step in human evolution. While this notion may comfort the meat industry, it's simply not true, scientifically.
Dr. T. Colin Campbell, professor emeritus at Cornell University and author of The China Study, explains that in fact, we only recently (historically speaking) began eating meat, and that the inclusion of meat in our diet came well after we became who we are today. He explains that "the birth of agriculture only started about 10,000 years ago at a time when it became considerably more convenient to herd animals. This is not nearly as long as the time [that] fashioned our basic biochemical functionality (at least tens of millions of years) and which functionality depends on the nutrient composition of plant-based foods."
That jibes with what Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine President Dr. Neal Barnard says in his book, The Power of Your Plate, in which he explains that "early humans had diets very much like other great apes, which is to say a largely plant-based diet, drawing on foods we can pick with our hands. Research suggests that meat-eating probably began by scavenging--eating the leftovers that carnivores had left behind. However, our bodies have never adapted to it. To this day, meat-eaters have a higher incidence of heart disease, cancer, diabetes, and other problems."
There is no more authoritative source on anthropological issues than paleontologist Dr. Richard Leakey, who explains what anyone who has taken an introductory physiology course might have discerned intuitively--that humans are herbivores. Leakey notes that "[y]ou can't tear flesh by hand, you can't tear hide by hand.... We wouldn't have been able to deal with food source that required those large canines" (although we have teeth that are called "canines," they bear little resemblance to the canines of carnivores).
In fact, our hands are perfect for grabbing and picking fruits and vegetables. Similarly, like the intestines of other herbivores, ours are very long (carnivores have short intestines so they can quickly get rid of all that rotting flesh they eat). We don't have sharp claws to seize and hold down prey. And most of us (hopefully) lack the instinct that would drive us to chase and then kill animals and devour their raw carcasses. Dr. Milton Mills builds on these points and offers dozens more in his essay, "A Comparative Anatomy of Eating."
The point is this: Thousands of years ago when we were hunter-gatherers, we may have needed a bit of meat in our diets in times of scarcity, but we don't need it now. Says Dr. William C. Roberts, editor of the American Journal of Cardiology, "Although we think we are, and we act as if we are, human beings are not natural carnivores. When we kill animals to eat them, they end up killing us, because their flesh, which contains cholesterol and saturated fat, was never intended for human beings, who are natural herbivores."
Sure, most of us are "behavioral omnivores"--that is, we eat meat, so that defines us as omnivorous. But our evolution and physiology are herbivorous, and ample science proves that when we choose to eat meat, that causes problems, from decreased energy and a need for more sleep up to increased risk for obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer.
Old habits die hard, and it's convenient for people who like to eat meat to think that there is evidence to support their belief that eating meat is "natural" or the cause of our evolution. For many years, I too, clung to the idea that meat and dairy were good for me; I realize now that I was probably comforted to have justification for my continued attachment to the traditions I grew up with.
But in fact top nutritional and anthropological scientists from the most reputable institutions imaginable say categorically that humans are natural herbivores, and that we will be healthier today if we stick with our herbivorous roots. It may be inconvenient, but it alas, it is the truth.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kathy-freston/shattering-the-meat-myth_b_214390.html
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by Ben Reilly Mon Feb 01, 2016 7:17 pm
But then there's this:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/04/120420105539.htm
Carnivory is behind the evolutionary success of humankind. When early humans started to eat meat and eventually hunt, their new, higher-quality diet meant that women could wean their children earlier. Women could then give birth to more children during their reproductive life, which is a possible contribution to the population gradually spreading over the world. The connection between eating meat and a faster weaning process is shown by a research group from Lund University in Sweden, which compared close to 70 mammalian species and found clear patterns.
Learning to hunt was a decisive step in human evolution. Hunting necessitated communication, planning and the use of tools, all of which demanded a larger brain. At the same time, adding meat to the diet made it possible to develop this larger brain.
"This has been known for a long time. However, no one has previously shown the strong connection between meat eating and the duration of breast-feeding, which is a crucial piece of the puzzle in this context. Eating meat enabled the breast-feeding periods and thereby the time between births, to be shortened. This must have had a crucial impact on human evolution," says Elia Psouni of Lund University.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/04/120420105539.htm
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:02 pm
Even Herbivores can eat meat but Carnivores cannot eat plants and even Omnivores like ourselves cannot eat grasses or the vast majority of plant matter.
it is Simplyfing to the point of inaccuracy.
RED meat consuption is new and previous limited, small aniamls and incests have ALWAYS been a large part of the Homo spaiens and our ancestors diets.
this articles are dumb, they may as well be religious if they want to be so completely contradictory to science.
ALL mammals evolve from an Omnivorous mammal that outlived the dinosaurs.
Unless a mammal has specialized in the consumption of vegetation like cows they cannot consume grass or most leaves. BUT all Mammals can consume meat.
Homo Sapiens has never had a Herbivorous ancestor this is Proven by our lack or organs or evolved traits to assist plant consumption. We still just have the Omnivores stomach we have the organs for consumption of fruit, bugs and other invertebrates, barks, berries, nuts, smaller mammals, reptiles and birds plus limited leaf materials. We do not have the additional stomach or gullets needed for consumption of most plant material. Our ancestors have always been omnivores that consumed whatever they could. But we have Never been plant specialists.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:05 pm
Further evidence For OMNIVORISM is our teeth. Is the Pacu has had time to evolve the perfect teeth for it's Omnivorous diet, like it's close cousin the Piranha has had time to evolve the perfect flesh eaters.
Pacu (Portuguese pronunciation: [paˈku]) is a common name used in the aquarium trade to refer to several common species of omnivorous South American freshwater fish that are related to the piranha. Pacu and piranha do not have similar teeth, the main difference being jaw alignment; piranha have pointed, razor-sharp teeth in a pronounced underbite, whereas pacu have squarer, straighter teeth, which are uncannily similar to human teeth,
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Mon Feb 01, 2016 11:44 pm
Well,it seems, even science doesn't have the answer and contradicts itself, again!
Really, we should just gather all these blathering idiots up and feel them to the lions.
Really, we should just gather all these blathering idiots up and feel them to the lions.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by Ben Reilly Tue Feb 02, 2016 12:44 am
Red meat kills you and a vegetarian diet produces offspring that take too long to wean -- further proof that the "grand design" for human beings is nothing more than, live long enough to have kids and raise them. 
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:42 am
eddie wrote:Well,it seems, even science doesn't have the answer and contradicts itself, again!
Really, we should just gather all these blathering idiots up and feel them to the lions.
Actually it is Bad reporting as Usual
Notice they are talking about Hide etc Obviously Large Animals. Which are only eaten by top predators (or lucky scavengers) most omnivores (this the majority of meat consumers) eat smaller animals that they can put in their mouth whole. (and As the dickhead in Queensland showed you can eat a Rat sized animal) The problem is that the media want to say Vegetarian or Carnivore to the TRUTH Omnivore which we have always been. Fruit and Bugs (wood grubs) are the things we are best at digesting and are also the things our early ancestors would have eaten when still living in the trees.
We were not a predator before but to say we were vegetarian is wrong
we can see our own evolution in Baboons and Chimps
The Baboon is an omnivorous animal that is known to eat a wide variety of both plant matter and small animals. Fruits, seeds, tough roots and flowers all make up the bulk of their diet, along with insects, eggs, lizards and rodents. However, their large size and power also means that they sometimes hunt and kill larger prey such as young Gazelles.
The Chimpanzee is an omnivorous animal that eats hundreds of different types of food. The bulk of their diet is comprised of seasonal fruits, seeds and flowers that are picked from the trees, along with insects such as ants and termites that are extracted from their nests using a stick. However, they are known to eat larger prey too and when working together, sub-groups are able to kill monkeys and birds and have even been known to successfully hunt small antelope. Chimpanzees are the only animals (apart from Orang-Utans and Humans) that don't just use tools but also make them. They are known to strip the leaves and twigs off branches which are then inserted into a termite mound, where the termites crawl onto the branch and the Chimpanzee then licks them off.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Tue Feb 02, 2016 4:06 pm
I still reckon a plant-based diet is more beneficial health wise.
Vegetarians are at a lower risk with some cancers and heart diseases.
Vegetarians are at a lower risk with some cancers and heart diseases.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by nicko Tue Feb 02, 2016 5:49 pm
Nutters who live on nuts seeds and leaves, ever had I close look at 'em? Pale, weak and totally unsuited for hard manual work. Had one in my Squad, couldn't climb over a gate in half his kit.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:08 pm
nicko wrote:Nutters who live on nuts seeds and leaves, ever had I close look at 'em? Pale, weak and totally unsuited for hard manual work. Had one in my Squad, couldn't climb over a gate in half his kit.
Hahahaha that's a stereotype if ever I've heard one!!
That's like saying meat eaters are big fat sweaty pigs who are always ill and are too unfit to climb over a gate....
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by nicko Tue Feb 02, 2016 8:34 pm
How do you reach that conclusion?
I saw it happen on a training run, both men same size and hight, I a vegetarian, I eating normal Army food. The vegetarian had no where near the stamina of the others. How would the Vegie get on fighting in a desert? No plants to eat, but there are small mammals,lizards, rats etc. To stay alive he would have to eat meat.
I saw it happen on a training run, both men same size and hight, I a vegetarian, I eating normal Army food. The vegetarian had no where near the stamina of the others. How would the Vegie get on fighting in a desert? No plants to eat, but there are small mammals,lizards, rats etc. To stay alive he would have to eat meat.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Tue Feb 02, 2016 9:51 pm
nicko wrote:How do you reach that conclusion?
I saw it happen on a training run, both men same size and hight, I a vegetarian, I eating normal Army food. The vegetarian had no where near the stamina of the others. How would the Vegie get on fighting in a desert? No plants to eat, but there are small mammals,lizards, rats etc. To stay alive he would have to eat meat.
You're right, he would.
But if there were a huge disaster that wiped out all animals, or they became extinct, he'd have to find plants, fruits, seeds.
So what's your point?
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:01 pm
nicko wrote:How do you reach that conclusion?
I saw it happen on a training run, both men same size and hight, I a vegetarian, I eating normal Army food. The vegetarian had no where near the stamina of the others. How would the Vegie get on fighting in a desert? No plants to eat, but there are small mammals,lizards, rats etc. To stay alive he would have to eat meat.
and you point out exactly the reason that Homo sapien is a top omnivore, (only rats/mice and roaches really match us)
we are adpated to most enviroments on earth.
Because we have not over speicalized in anything but 'problem solving brain'
Exercise and Variety I think are the keys to good health, anything is excess is not good for you, and the variety keeps your 'systems' adaptive and 'in use' with healthy populations of all the different gut baterica.
P.S. No, I'm not claiming to be perfect, like most people i have my excesses and thing I can improve.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:07 pm
I agree Veya, nothing in excess is a good rule to live by.
Most people are quite naive about vegetarian diets though, they think that eating meat is the only and best protein there is.
Wrong.
I've read a lot about diets and food and I do know my stuff!
Most people are quite naive about vegetarian diets though, they think that eating meat is the only and best protein there is.
Wrong.
I've read a lot about diets and food and I do know my stuff!
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:11 pm
eddie wrote:nicko wrote:How do you reach that conclusion?
I saw it happen on a training run, both men same size and hight, I a vegetarian, I eating normal Army food. The vegetarian had no where near the stamina of the others. How would the Vegie get on fighting in a desert? No plants to eat, but there are small mammals,lizards, rats etc. To stay alive he would have to eat meat.
You're right, he would.
But if there were a huge disaster that wiped out all animals, or they became extinct, he'd have to find plants, fruits, seeds.
So what's your point?
not going to happen on this rock because there are rats mice and roaches, among others, that are even more adaptive and more capable of survival than us.
Fruiting plants are less likely to survive a mass disaster than roaches. tuber plants would be most likely edible plants to survive (like potatoes etc)
Last edited by veya_victaous on Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:23 pm
eddie wrote:I agree Veya, nothing in excess is a good rule to live by.
Most people are quite naive about vegetarian diets though, they think that eating meat is the only and best protein there is.
Wrong.
I've read a lot about diets and food and I do know my stuff!
I have an interest in medicinal teas and natural cures more than diets
I think there is some truth to good health through healthy gut bacteria.
I feel healthier having added probiotic 'fermented milk drinks' to my diet (yakult is the main one)
And the Red meat component is probably over stated, you could adequately replace it with bugs and little critters
I think the red meat (large animal) consumption goes hand in hand with our social development because to catch the equivalent in bugs takes too long so we wouldn't have had as much time to socialize or the drivers for cooperation that are inherent in trying to hunt large game. Similarly to survive off basic plant matter alone means you have to spend all day chewing cud like the cow does and we woudl never have reached out position now if we had followed that path.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by Raggamuffin Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:33 pm
Why do some people assume that vegetarians only eat plants? They eat eggs, dairy products, quorn, etc.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:10 am
'Primarily' eat plant matterRaggamuffin wrote:Why do some people assume that vegetarians only eat plants? They eat eggs, dairy products, quorn, etc.
even herbivores Don’t JUST eat plants, which is a big part of why the OP is false. No Mammal was originally herbivore, All mammals retain the ability to digests 'light flesh' and invertebrates which supports that fact, as well as the fossil record, we all come from a small omnivorous rat like animal.
to eat eggs basically removes any moral standing regarding sentient life (same with fish)
Dairy products is probably the Only thing we eat where there is valid debate as to our capacity to consume it. (Besides over processed plastic foods)
and WTF is Quorn really? (plastic? Or tofu)
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by Raggamuffin Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:16 am
Some meat eaters often talk about vegetarians as if they only eat lettuce or carrots.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by veya_victaous Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:19 am
Raggamuffin wrote:Some meat eaters often talk about vegetarians as if they only eat lettuce or carrots.
to be fair the ones that are the biggest wankers do.... direct that at either side.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:02 pm
Veya, quorn is a fungus
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quorn
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quorn
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by Raggamuffin Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:13 pm
eddie wrote:Veya, quorn is a fungus
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quorn
Technically a plant I guess, but it contains egg.
Anyway, don't mention fungus - we'll be back onto mushrooms again.
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Re: Shattering The Meat Myth: Humans Are Natural Vegetarians
by eddie Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:31 pm
Raggamuffin wrote:eddie wrote:Veya, quorn is a fungus
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quorn
Technically a plant I guess, but it contains egg.
Anyway, don't mention fungus - we'll be back onto mushrooms again.
Hahahahaha true
And quorn is a microprotein derived from a fungus of some kind...can't remember which
I've put a link to it
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