Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
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Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
During several meetings I recently had with EU officials in Brussels, they argued that it is time to revive the Middle East Quartet, which consists of the US, EU, Russia, and the UN, to resurrect the Israeli-Palestinian peace process. I took the opposite position because I believe that the Quartet failed from the onset to breathe new life into the peace negotiations; in fact, it has become a major impediment to the peace process.
The Quartet’s three preconditions, which require Hamas to recognize Israel, accept previous agreements and obligations, and forsake violence before it can become a legitimate partner in the peace talks, are outdated and impractical because these preconditions are tantamount to surrender.
The Quartet’s demands on Hamas make it impossible for its leadership to negotiate under those terms—and without Hamas’ full participation as an integral part of the Palestinian delegation, no Israeli-Palestinian peace can endure even if achieved.
In fact, any Israeli leader who genuinely seeks a peace agreement should not demand that Hamas first meet the Quartet’s requirements. Having suffered the indignities of the blockade for so long, even if Hamas agreed to negotiate under duress from its current position of weakness a peace agreement or a long-term ceasefire (hudna), it would only be a question of time when they will rise again to reclaim their dignity.
Netanyahu supports the Quartet’s preconditions because he knows full well that Hamas will not accept them. Thus, the Quartet has de facto been providing Netanyahu with the political cover he needs to forestall any substantive negotiations, claiming that the Palestinians are bent on destroying Israel while playing Hamas against the PA and vice versa.
Although it is unlikely that the Obama administration will push for the resumption of peace talks during an election year, 2016 does provide a unique opportunity for the US and the EU, who are the only effective players in the Quartet, to pave the way for serious negotiations in 2017 and beyond, provided that they make the Arab Peace Initiative (API) framework (not the Quartet’s) central to any future talks.
Contrary to the prevailing view among many Israelis, the API has not been presented to Israel on a take it or leave it basis, and it provides several common denominators between Hamas and Israel to achieve a two-state solution while offering Hamas a face-saving way out.
The US and the EU can persuade several Arab/Muslim states, especially Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, and Turkey, who enjoy considerable influence on Hamas, to exert political and material pressure on its leadership to formally adopt the API.
On more than one occasion (including in 2011, 2013, and 2014), Hamas clearly stated that it is willing to negotiate a peace agreement with provisions almost identical to the API. Hamas understands that Israel is there to stay and is now looking for ways to further ease the blockade and eventually lift it altogether, which can be facilitated in the context of the API.
In the same vein, the US along with the EU should relentlessly exert intense pressure on Israel to embrace the API as well. Currently, thousands of Israeli notables, including former President Peres, Yuval Rabin (the son of Yitzhak Rabin), former heads of security agencies including ex-Mossad chief Meir Dagan, much of the academic community, think tanks, retired generals, and more than half of the Israeli public support the API.
A poll commissioned by the Israel Peace Initiative in 2013 found that 55 percent of respondents support the API; that jumps to 69% if it is supported by the prime minister.
Moreover, there are several political parties in the opposition who view the API as central to reaching an enduring peace. Yair Lapid, the leader of the centrist Yesh Atid party, recently stated: “Convening a regional conference as the opening shot for a comprehensive regional arrangement is the most effective tactical and political tool for getting this process going. The framework of the discussions at this conference must be the Saudi-Arab initiative [the API] of 2002.”
The Initiative makes recognition of Israel conditioned upon Israel’s acceptance of a two-state solution based on the 1967 borders with some land swaps, agreed upon between Arab foreign ministers and Secretary of State John Kerry. In addition, the API would open the door for Hamas to return to the Arab states’ fold and no longer be labeled as a terrorist organization.
Indeed, Hamas is not a terrorist organization by any classic definition because many countries, including Brazil, Switzerland, Qatar, and Turkey, transact with Hamas as a normal entity. Israel itself deals with Hamas daily and on many fronts, including trade, travel, and tacitly on matters of security concerns, to maintain the informal ceasefire.
The adoption of the API by both Israel and Hamas will be a game changer, especially now that the Arab states are more disposed to normalize relations with Israel because of the regional turmoil and because both Israel and the Arab states have a common enemy in Iran.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is becoming ever more intractable each passing day. It is time for the US and the EU to chart a new path and disabuse themselves of the notion that they must stick to past frameworks for peace, especially the Quartet, when in fact it has not advanced the peace process one single iota.
Times have changed; the Quartet was defunct from day one, and it will not succeed now by trying to resuscitate it. Instead, the focus must be on the universality of the API, around which a majority of Israelis and Palestinians, as well as the Arab states and the international community, can rally.
Israelis and Palestinians alike must focus throughout 2016 to assuage the psychological barrier by taking reconciliatory measures with the support and the encouragement of the US and the EU and pave the way for the resumption of credible peace negotiations with unwavering commitment.
Such commitment could lead to an Israeli-Palestinian agreement in the context of a comprehensive Arab-Israeli peace, which the Israelis seek and only the API can provide.
The Quartet must be abandoned in favor of the API, which has been gaining momentum in recent months absent any other viable alternative framework for peace.
http://www.alonben-meir.com/article/abandoning-the-quartet-in-favor-of-the-arab-peace-initiative/?utm_source=Subscribers&utm_campaign=49c1c7081e-UA-5963141-2&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_6e846e6217-49c1c7081e-310002545
Dr. Alon Ben-Meir
Dr. Alon Ben Meir is a professor and Senior Fellow at New York University’s Center for Global Affairs and Senior Fellow at the World Policy Institute. Dr. Ben-Meir is an expert on Middle East politics and affairs, specializing in international negotiations and conflict resolution. In the past seventeen years, Ben-Meir has been directly involved in various negotiations between Israel and its neighboring countries and Turkey.
Ben-Meir hosts “Global Leaders: Conversations with Alon Ben-Meir,” a speaking series of debates and conversations with top policy-makers from around the world held each semester at NYU. He also regularly briefs at the U.S. State Department for the International Visitors Program. He writes a weekly article that appear in scores of newspapers, magazines and websites including the Huffington Post, Jerusalem Post, Middle East Times, Times of Israel, Epoch Times, the Political Quarterly, the Harvard Review, and many other publications in Arabic and English.
He has been featured on networks such as ABC, Al Jazeera (English and Arabic), Al Arabiya, al-Hurra, CNN, Russia Today and NBC. He has authored seven books related to Middle East and is currently working on a new book about the psychological dimension of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Dr. Ben-Meir holds a master’s degree in philosophy and a doctorate in international relations from Oxford University.
All Israel have come back with is limited local government under the control of Israel. So much for wanting peace.
The Quartet’s three preconditions, which require Hamas to recognize Israel, accept previous agreements and obligations, and forsake violence before it can become a legitimate partner in the peace talks, are outdated and impractical because these preconditions are tantamount to surrender.
The Quartet’s demands on Hamas make it impossible for its leadership to negotiate under those terms—and without Hamas’ full participation as an integral part of the Palestinian delegation, no Israeli-Palestinian peace can endure even if achieved.
In fact, any Israeli leader who genuinely seeks a peace agreement should not demand that Hamas first meet the Quartet’s requirements. Having suffered the indignities of the blockade for so long, even if Hamas agreed to negotiate under duress from its current position of weakness a peace agreement or a long-term ceasefire (hudna), it would only be a question of time when they will rise again to reclaim their dignity.
Netanyahu supports the Quartet’s preconditions because he knows full well that Hamas will not accept them. Thus, the Quartet has de facto been providing Netanyahu with the political cover he needs to forestall any substantive negotiations, claiming that the Palestinians are bent on destroying Israel while playing Hamas against the PA and vice versa.
Although it is unlikely that the Obama administration will push for the resumption of peace talks during an election year, 2016 does provide a unique opportunity for the US and the EU, who are the only effective players in the Quartet, to pave the way for serious negotiations in 2017 and beyond, provided that they make the Arab Peace Initiative (API) framework (not the Quartet’s) central to any future talks.
Contrary to the prevailing view among many Israelis, the API has not been presented to Israel on a take it or leave it basis, and it provides several common denominators between Hamas and Israel to achieve a two-state solution while offering Hamas a face-saving way out.
The US and the EU can persuade several Arab/Muslim states, especially Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, and Turkey, who enjoy considerable influence on Hamas, to exert political and material pressure on its leadership to formally adopt the API.
On more than one occasion (including in 2011, 2013, and 2014), Hamas clearly stated that it is willing to negotiate a peace agreement with provisions almost identical to the API. Hamas understands that Israel is there to stay and is now looking for ways to further ease the blockade and eventually lift it altogether, which can be facilitated in the context of the API.
In the same vein, the US along with the EU should relentlessly exert intense pressure on Israel to embrace the API as well. Currently, thousands of Israeli notables, including former President Peres, Yuval Rabin (the son of Yitzhak Rabin), former heads of security agencies including ex-Mossad chief Meir Dagan, much of the academic community, think tanks, retired generals, and more than half of the Israeli public support the API.
A poll commissioned by the Israel Peace Initiative in 2013 found that 55 percent of respondents support the API; that jumps to 69% if it is supported by the prime minister.
Moreover, there are several political parties in the opposition who view the API as central to reaching an enduring peace. Yair Lapid, the leader of the centrist Yesh Atid party, recently stated: “Convening a regional conference as the opening shot for a comprehensive regional arrangement is the most effective tactical and political tool for getting this process going. The framework of the discussions at this conference must be the Saudi-Arab initiative [the API] of 2002.”
The Initiative makes recognition of Israel conditioned upon Israel’s acceptance of a two-state solution based on the 1967 borders with some land swaps, agreed upon between Arab foreign ministers and Secretary of State John Kerry. In addition, the API would open the door for Hamas to return to the Arab states’ fold and no longer be labeled as a terrorist organization.
Indeed, Hamas is not a terrorist organization by any classic definition because many countries, including Brazil, Switzerland, Qatar, and Turkey, transact with Hamas as a normal entity. Israel itself deals with Hamas daily and on many fronts, including trade, travel, and tacitly on matters of security concerns, to maintain the informal ceasefire.
The adoption of the API by both Israel and Hamas will be a game changer, especially now that the Arab states are more disposed to normalize relations with Israel because of the regional turmoil and because both Israel and the Arab states have a common enemy in Iran.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is becoming ever more intractable each passing day. It is time for the US and the EU to chart a new path and disabuse themselves of the notion that they must stick to past frameworks for peace, especially the Quartet, when in fact it has not advanced the peace process one single iota.
Times have changed; the Quartet was defunct from day one, and it will not succeed now by trying to resuscitate it. Instead, the focus must be on the universality of the API, around which a majority of Israelis and Palestinians, as well as the Arab states and the international community, can rally.
Israelis and Palestinians alike must focus throughout 2016 to assuage the psychological barrier by taking reconciliatory measures with the support and the encouragement of the US and the EU and pave the way for the resumption of credible peace negotiations with unwavering commitment.
Such commitment could lead to an Israeli-Palestinian agreement in the context of a comprehensive Arab-Israeli peace, which the Israelis seek and only the API can provide.
The Quartet must be abandoned in favor of the API, which has been gaining momentum in recent months absent any other viable alternative framework for peace.
http://www.alonben-meir.com/article/abandoning-the-quartet-in-favor-of-the-arab-peace-initiative/?utm_source=Subscribers&utm_campaign=49c1c7081e-UA-5963141-2&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_6e846e6217-49c1c7081e-310002545
Dr. Alon Ben-Meir
Dr. Alon Ben Meir is a professor and Senior Fellow at New York University’s Center for Global Affairs and Senior Fellow at the World Policy Institute. Dr. Ben-Meir is an expert on Middle East politics and affairs, specializing in international negotiations and conflict resolution. In the past seventeen years, Ben-Meir has been directly involved in various negotiations between Israel and its neighboring countries and Turkey.
Ben-Meir hosts “Global Leaders: Conversations with Alon Ben-Meir,” a speaking series of debates and conversations with top policy-makers from around the world held each semester at NYU. He also regularly briefs at the U.S. State Department for the International Visitors Program. He writes a weekly article that appear in scores of newspapers, magazines and websites including the Huffington Post, Jerusalem Post, Middle East Times, Times of Israel, Epoch Times, the Political Quarterly, the Harvard Review, and many other publications in Arabic and English.
He has been featured on networks such as ABC, Al Jazeera (English and Arabic), Al Arabiya, al-Hurra, CNN, Russia Today and NBC. He has authored seven books related to Middle East and is currently working on a new book about the psychological dimension of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Dr. Ben-Meir holds a master’s degree in philosophy and a doctorate in international relations from Oxford University.
All Israel have come back with is limited local government under the control of Israel. So much for wanting peace.
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Excelent article by Alon. The only peace deal that genuinly gave the Palestinian's a state under the two state solution.
Israel knocked it back because a two state solution based on a sovereign state for Palestine is something they will never agree to.
Israel knocked it back because a two state solution based on a sovereign state for Palestine is something they will never agree to.
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Except we know everytime the Palestinian authorities have thwarted any chance of a palestinian state because they refuse to accept israel and see it is all occupied. Sadly some regressive lefties fail to see all the evidence.
Israel has made many concessions to what in all reality are the agressors in the Arabs themselves. They have made peace with Jordan and Eygpt, but the Palestinian authorities at every turn spurn any chance of becomeing a nation, the last case being Abbas, where the evidence is overwhelming he was offered the vast majority of the West Bank and part of Jeruslame.
Its times these two jokers stop making countless excuses.
Now there is no doubt the settlerments hinder any peace deal, but what hinders it more than anything, is the continued belief that Israel is all occupied.
Israel has made many concessions to what in all reality are the agressors in the Arabs themselves. They have made peace with Jordan and Eygpt, but the Palestinian authorities at every turn spurn any chance of becomeing a nation, the last case being Abbas, where the evidence is overwhelming he was offered the vast majority of the West Bank and part of Jeruslame.
Its times these two jokers stop making countless excuses.
Now there is no doubt the settlerments hinder any peace deal, but what hinders it more than anything, is the continued belief that Israel is all occupied.
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:Except we know everytime the Palestinian authorities have thwarted any chance of a palestinian state because they refuse to accept israel and see it is all occupied. Sadly some regressive lefties fail to see all the evidence.
Israel has made many concessions to what in all reality are the agressors in the Arabs themselves. They have made peace with Jordan and Eygpt, but the Palestinian authorities at every turn spurn any chance of becomeing a nation, the last case being Abbas, where the evidence is overwhelming he was offered the vast majority of the West Bank and part of Jeruslame.
Its times these two jokers stop making countless excuses.
Now there is no doubt the settlerments hinder any peace deal, but what hinders it more than anything, is the continued belief that Israel is all occupied.
When were the Palestinian's ever offered their own sovereign state under the UN charte of Statehood?
Never happened and it never will. Alon Ben-Meir tells it like it was. Israel rejected a genuine peace offer.
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Oh dear more exciuses from the Hamas supporter,.
3 times they could have had a state and 3 times they spurned this because they did not recognise the Jewish state holding some daft religious belief the lands belong to the Muslims.
This is backed up by the 1964 PA charter which did not even recognise the occupation by Jordan of the West bank.
It seems someone again is embarressing himself on history
3 times they could have had a state and 3 times they spurned this because they did not recognise the Jewish state holding some daft religious belief the lands belong to the Muslims.
This is backed up by the 1964 PA charter which did not even recognise the occupation by Jordan of the West bank.
It seems someone again is embarressing himself on history
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
It's not a religious belief, as many Palestinians are Christian. Much of the land they have deeds for and have lived there for hundreds of years. It is theirs (and I am talking about the West Bank and Gaza, they have already said they will recognise Israel, even though Israel will not say it recognises Palestine).
If Italy said, well hundreds of years ago the Romans lived in Britain, so Britain is ours, you'd be ok with that then?
Or, as a Zionist terrorist supporter, you don't really give a damn about the rights of Palestinians, you just want Israel to crush them out of existance.
If Italy said, well hundreds of years ago the Romans lived in Britain, so Britain is ours, you'd be ok with that then?
Or, as a Zionist terrorist supporter, you don't really give a damn about the rights of Palestinians, you just want Israel to crush them out of existance.
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Many?
How many Palestinian Christians are left in Gaza?
The Palestinian terrirtories is listed in the top 50 nations of persecution to Christians, so I really think you have no leg to stand on there.
Here we go again about lands and deeds.
Most Jews and Arabs migrated to the area over the last 150 years, only a small percentage of each group has been there longer and even then Jews would go back further, being as the Arabs came later through invasions. I have already posted the evidence on this and you buy into poor crap claims. So any history for both people who again the Palestinian nationality is something invented soley to be in opposition to Israel created a few decades agao, shows how out of touch you are with reality.
How many Palestinian Christians are left in Gaza?
The Palestinian terrirtories is listed in the top 50 nations of persecution to Christians, so I really think you have no leg to stand on there.
Here we go again about lands and deeds.
Most Jews and Arabs migrated to the area over the last 150 years, only a small percentage of each group has been there longer and even then Jews would go back further, being as the Arabs came later through invasions. I have already posted the evidence on this and you buy into poor crap claims. So any history for both people who again the Palestinian nationality is something invented soley to be in opposition to Israel created a few decades agao, shows how out of touch you are with reality.
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Well, you really have swallowed the Israeli hasbara whole and come back for more. Complete and utter rubbish.
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
No I speak in facts sassy where as you swallow bullshit, would you like me to post the evidence again for you?
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
The central piece denied and evaded by Israel is the Nakba ("catastrophe" in Arabic) of 1948, when Palestinians were ruthlessly attacked, massacred and driven from their homes into refugee camps by Zionist terror groups, and never allowed to return in violation of international law. This is the deeply flawed foundation upon which Israel was established and upon which its entire subsequent society remains structurally unsteady, morally corrupt, legally culpable, and psychologically damaged. Israel has inevitably suffered from a "spoiled identity" (a concept of sociologist Erving Goffman) against which it defends by outright lies, hysterical accusations of "anti-Semitism" and other transparent defense mechanisms, and the consequences to its Palestinian victims remain tragic and ruinous. This pathological system has been aided and abetted by the United States, which stands alone in the world as a supporter and defender of Israel. Without understanding this pathological relationship, leading to an alteration in US policies toward Israel, no just or enduring solution will be possible. This conflict is typically framed as a contest between "two sides" or "two narratives" that either blames the Palestinians as "terrorists" or implies a non-existent symmetry: equivalence of violence, blame for the conflict, suffering, legitimacy of claims, and responsibility for finding a solution. In truth, the Palestinians are an invaded, dispossessed, occupied, brutalized, blockaded, and segregated people who have the right to resist under international law and have steadfastly done so for many decades in largely non-violent ways. |
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A fictitious account omitting Israeli lawlessness and ignoring the lonely and rightful Palestinian struggle for justice has been relentlessly recited and perpetuated by the American press and entertainment media under influence of the pro-Israel lobby and social influence network. |
Our position is derived not from any "narrative" but from the empirical evidence: the abundantly documented history, established doctrines of international law including United Nations resolutions and international court judgments, ordinary morality recognized by civilized peoples, and commitment to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. |
Until the Nakba is acknowledged, its crimes addressed and restitution provided, there can be no justice or justice-based peace. Toward the goal of justice, without which enduring peace will remain elusive, this web site is committed. * The key in our logo, many of which are still held by Palestinian refugees expelled in 1948, represents the Palestinians' right to return under international law, and has remained a cherished symbol of their steadfast resistance against dispossession, occupation, and subjugation by the state of Israel. |
On May 14, 1948, Israel declared itself a new, independent state, and was soon thereafter attacked by assembled forces of the Arab world determined to destroy this proud, determined newcomer to the region -- or so the legend has been perpetuated for over six decades, propelled by the best-selling 1958 Leon Uris novel, Exodus, said to have originated as a PR effort to glamorize Israel and sanitize its dishonorable establishment. This was soon followed in 1960 by the Otto Preminger film that spread the myth to a much larger audience and simplified it further into essentially a cowboys and Indians tale. Whether deliberate or inadvertent, the widespread appeal of this film may well reflect its close correspondence with America's own ethnic cleansing of our indigenous population and its whitewashed reversal of heroes and villains, where Zionism and Manifest Destiny are companion ideologies, and Israeli "settlers" match American "pioneers." |
Three Zionist terror groups (as designated by the United Nations) systematically planned and executed the expulsion of the Palestinians, who owned over 93% of Palestine in 1947. This ethnic cleansing operation had been prepared over the preceding year, ready for implementation when perceived necessary to drive out the indigenous Arab population and seize their land and properties once the British adminstrative authority was gone.
These terrorist "militias" had ethnically cleansed a third of the Palestinian population before the British departed in May 1948 and by the end of 1948 had driven over 3/4 million Palestinians into 59 refugee camps hastily constructed to accommodate them by UNRWA (United Nations Relief and Works Agency), newly created to respond to what Palestinians called their "catastrophe" - al Nakba.
Scattered Arab forces intervened after the British withdrawal, but were no match for the better-organized, better-armed and much better-funded Zionist militias now merged into the Israeli Defense Force (IDF). Since most Arab countries had recently emerged from post-WWI mandates under British or French administration, the only credible Arab army was the Arab Legion of Transjordan which the Zionists co-opted in an agreement with King Abdullah of Transjordan. Under this agreement Abdullah would keep Judea and Samaria (now the West Bank) and the Zionists were allowed to "cleanse" (their term) the rest of Palestine unopposed.
By the end of the ethnic cleansing campaign, the Zionists had destroyed and/or depopulated 531 Arab villages and eleven urban areas, and had committed 33 documented massacres that killed some 13,000 largely defenseless Arabs, the most notorious of which was Dar Yassein (above). In an article three decades later for The American Zionist, Mordechai Nisan of the Truman Research Centre of the Hebrew University in Jerusalem wrote, “Without terror it is unlikely that Jewish independence would have been achieved when it was.”
This was an intentional terrorist strategy. Reports of these massacres terrified other Arab villages into fleeing their homes and communities in the path of approaching Jewish forces. By 1950 nearly a million Palestinian refugees had been registered by the UN in refugee camps with land claims against Israel. With their descendents who are legal heirs to the stolen property, that number now exceeds 4½ million, the largest and longest-standing refugee population in the world. Palestinian leaders, when unable to protect the villages, had reportedly advised the residents to flee but evidence of this is lacking. Nevertheless, this has been used shamelessly by Zionist propagandists to claim that the Palestinians left voluntarily or unnecessarily upon direction by their leaders.
Israeli historian Ilan Pappe has declared that "catastrophe" is an inaccurate term with its connotations of natural disaster. Rather, he clearly identifies these acts as crimes that should be so identified.
Following these atrocities, some Jewish communities - which had found refuge in Arab communities from Christian persecution in Europe and lived in peace with Arabs for centuries throughout the Middle East and North Africa - fled their homes in fear of retribution for Jewish aggression in Palestine. This has been used by Zionist propagandists to imply that some sort of balanced population exchange occurred to invalidate the Palestinian right of return. But most of these Jewish immigrants to Israel were in fact recruited by Zionism and motivated by incentives and subsidies offered by the new state, including involuntarily vacated Palestinian homes, rather than escape from Arab persecution. Notably large Jewish populations immigrated to Israel from Morrocco and Yemen in response to Israeli invitations and incentives. Jewish exodus from North Africa was also motivated by contemporaneous upheavals in the region against post-war French efforts to re-establish its colonies.
Israel cast itself as a refuge, calling for "ingathering of the exiles." However, since the Mizrahi (Arab) and Sephardic (Iberian) Jews had not suffered Russian pogroms or the Holocaust, many had no interest in uprooting their long established communities for transplantation to Israel. Some Arab expulsion of their Jewish neighbors occurred in some communities due to fear of Zionism, especially in Egypt following their 1956 invasion by Israel, but this "ingathering" was largely solicited by Israel and actively encouraged by false flag Mossad attacks on synagogues and Jewish businesses to frighten Jews in Egypt and Iraq into relocating.
Any legitimate Jewish refugees - like Palestinians - had the right to file claims with the UN High Commissioner for Refugees. How many have done so? Whatever the number, if any, their claims are irrelevant to Palestinian claims. Most importantly, have Jewish refugees - like Palestinians - been denied the right to return? Quite the contrary. In fact, both Egypt and Iraq published prominent invitations in major newspapers for Jewish emigrants to return.
http://www.al-nakba-history.com/origins1948.html
Just to give you a starter on the truth instead of the lies you lap up.
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:Many?
How many Palestinian Christians are left in Gaza?
The Palestinian terrirtories is listed in the top 50 nations of persecution to Christians, so I really think you have no leg to stand on there.
Here we go again about lands and deeds.
Most Jews and Arabs migrated to the area over the last 150 years, only a small percentage of each group has been there longer and even then Jews would go back further, being as the Arabs came later through invasions. I have already posted the evidence on this and you buy into poor crap claims. So any history for both people who again the Palestinian nationality is something invented soley to be in opposition to Israel created a few decades agao, shows how out of touch you are with reality.
You really do have tp read Alon Ben-Meir's article - it will do you the world of good and enhance your education on bringing about peace.
Go on, I'm sure you can do it and comment on it rather than firing off with all these diversions.
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
You really have to stop supporting regressive groups that discrminate against women, homosexuals and Christians who also glorify the murder of Jews.
It may help you stop being an ignorant twat
Just some advice mind
It may help you stop being an ignorant twat
Just some advice mind
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Says the ignorant twat, Dick the Dodger.
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Are the other poster who admitted to supporting Hamas also.
You see the regressive lefty does not mind Islamic oppression, that is acceptable to them
You see the regressive lefty does not mind Islamic oppression, that is acceptable to them
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:Are the other poster who admitted to supporting Hamas also.
You see the regressive lefty does not mind Islamic oppression, that is acceptable to them
I knew you wouldn't read it. It's all too much for you
pat pat there there
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
I knew you would still back and excuse islamic extremism and ignore this as you think it makes you in some way discrminating against people.
What it does make you is spinless and gutless to say the truth.
I read many articles but it seems you are so out of your league you want me to debate other people and their views.
Sums you up
What it does make you is spinless and gutless to say the truth.
I read many articles but it seems you are so out of your league you want me to debate other people and their views.
Sums you up
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:I knew you would still back and excuse islamic extremism and ignore this as you think it makes you in some way discrminating against people.
What it does make you is spinless and gutless to say the truth.
I read many articles but it seems you are so out of your league you want me to debate other people and their views.
Sums you up
I don't back any extremists but you do and it shows.
You want me to debate the authors of the articles you post. I'd be as well
Pat pat, there there.
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Are you denying you backed Hamas?
Show me anywhere I have backed extremists?
never have
Again the poor wee boy has to resort to lying lol
Show me anywhere I have backed extremists?
never have
Again the poor wee boy has to resort to lying lol
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:Are you denying you backed Hamas?
Show me anywhere I have backed extremists?
never have
Again the poor wee boy has to resort to lying lol
I back political Hamas in persuing a peace process to bring about a two state solution.
You back the Likud Party and their extremist policies against the people of Palestine.
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Irn Bru wrote:Richard The Lionheart wrote:Are you denying you backed Hamas?
Show me anywhere I have backed extremists?
never have
Again the poor wee boy has to resort to lying lol
I back political Hamas in persuing a peace process to bring about a two state solution.
You back the Likud Party and their extremist policies against the people of Palestine.
Who discrminate against women, homosexuals, Christians and promote hate of the Jews.Glorfiy the murder of Jewish civillians and glorify the terroprists who carry out such attacks
That makes you the lowest form of scum
I have never backed the Likud party ever, showing you now are desperate to lie even further.
Seriously like I said, go and live in Gaza with your extremist brothers
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:Irn Bru wrote:Richard The Lionheart wrote:Are you denying you backed Hamas?
Show me anywhere I have backed extremists?
never have
Again the poor wee boy has to resort to lying lol
I back political Hamas in persuing a peace process to bring about a two state solution.
You back the Likud Party and their extremist policies against the people of Palestine.
Who discrminate against women, homosexuals, Christians and promote hate of the Jews.Glorfiy the murder of Jewish civillians and glorify the terroprists who carry out such attacks
That makes you the lowest form of scum
I have never backed the Likud party ever, showing you now are desperate to lie even further.
Seriously like I said, go and live in Gaza with your extremist brothers
Right, here's your chance. Condemn the Likud Party for it's policies towards the creation of a state of Eretz Israel and the Palestinian's only ever being given local government under Israels's contro.l
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
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Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
I condemn the Likud party as I have done before
The Palestinians in the west bank of area a and b are not under Israel control and neither is gaza under israel control.
Area c is under Israel contol as of the Oslo accord.
At least I can condemn Likud party and I have constantly condemned the settlements.
You though still support a oppressive islamist group that has no intention of a two state solution.
Peace will come when the palestinians take the olive branch of peace.
They have nev er wanted it and peace will not come under the Likud party either and hence why I have always said israel needs a more Liberal party in power
The Palestinians in the west bank of area a and b are not under Israel control and neither is gaza under israel control.
Area c is under Israel contol as of the Oslo accord.
At least I can condemn Likud party and I have constantly condemned the settlements.
You though still support a oppressive islamist group that has no intention of a two state solution.
Peace will come when the palestinians take the olive branch of peace.
They have nev er wanted it and peace will not come under the Likud party either and hence why I have always said israel needs a more Liberal party in power
Guest- Guest
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Richard The Lionheart wrote:I condemn the Likud party as I have done before
The Palestinians in the west bank of area a and b are not under Israel control and neither is gaza under israel control.
Area c is under Israel contol as of the Oslo accord.
At least I can condemn Likud party and I have constantly condemned the settlements.
You though still support a oppressive islamist group that has no intention of a two state solution.
Peace will come when the palestinians take the olive branch of peace.
They have nev er wanted it and peace will not come under the Likud party either and hence why I have always said israel needs a more Liberal party in power
Read Alon Ben-Meir's article beacuase it debunks everythin you say about peace offers You can't it's all too much for you
Irn Bru- The Tartan terror. Keeper of the royal sporran. Chief Haggis Hunter
- Posts : 7719
Join date : 2013-12-11
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Abandoning The Quartet In Favor Of The Arab Peace Initiative
Oh so one person claims to debunk me based on what evidence?
Seriously you are such a child if you think that I need to debate someone else when you cannot even reason any points or back it up with evidence
The point you fall down on Irn is that Israel has achieved peace with other Arab nations, so the question you need to ask is why not the Palestinians.
They refuse to accept Israel because they have continued to have viewed it as occuppied since its creation.
So if you want to man up back up your claims, asI will easily debunk them with countless evidence.
Seriously you are such a child if you think that I need to debate someone else when you cannot even reason any points or back it up with evidence
The point you fall down on Irn is that Israel has achieved peace with other Arab nations, so the question you need to ask is why not the Palestinians.
They refuse to accept Israel because they have continued to have viewed it as occuppied since its creation.
So if you want to man up back up your claims, asI will easily debunk them with countless evidence.
Guest- Guest
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