What’s wrong with 'PC'?

First topic message reminder :

Republican presidential contender Donald Trump is making the anti-PC stand his presidential campaign platform.  If he’s going to turn the 2016 electoral campaign into a devotional against PC, we ought to have some introspection into what we mean by the term.  PC stands for “politically correctness”.  Wiki defines it as:

Wiki wrote:…pejorative term used to criticize language, actions, or policies seen as being excessively calculated to not offend or disadvantage any particular group of people in society.

Certainly to be “correct”, or to “not offend” is ordinarily not objectionable.  Conservatives, most of all, argue that there should be order and people should follow proper procedures.  And we have manners, after all.  And even raucous white supremacists might agree to refrain from urinating in the corner of the dining room.  In sum, it’s okay to be correct in certain circumstances.

And we don’t find talking politics objectionable.  We do that all the time on this website.  ISIS?  UKIP?  Tea Party?  LW, or lefties?  RW, or righties?  Privatization?  Gaza? Benefits?  Austerity?  Voter suppression?  We talk about politics all the time.  We may hurl epithets back and forth at one another, but we don’t need a separate concept to do that.  Why waste the time objecting to PC?

The only word I see in the definition above that stands out, is “excessively”.  So, if its only ‘excessive’ that we object to, are we speaking only about degrees?  You mean this whole concept of PC that has Donald Trump at the head of the Republican polls in American, distills down to only degrees?  It’s like someone is saying: “You can shout, but don’t be ‘excessively’ loud”.  

That explanation is much too lightweight...flighty.  I think there is more in the gut when we laugh at objets PC.  Here's what I think: When we were boys, we used to love to go around upsetting the ordinary…the proper.  Farting in church was only small time.  We used to toilet paper (called 'tp'-ing) whole houses.  Once, in high school, the rowdy boys disassembled a car and rebuilt it on the roof of the gym.  As a freshman at Dartmouth University, my brother’s friends used to wire urinals to deliver shocks to boys peeing (did you know that Sulphur conducts electricity?).  Yes, there is an adolescent spirit in all of us that likes the bad-boy pranks.

And that is the instinct that I believe motivates the anti-PC crowd.  Shock-value, plain and simple.  Trump supporters love to diss Hispanics—it’s so hilarious to be able to say…get back to Mexico, you wetback!  And a sanctified war hero like John McCain…let’s light a firecracker under his shoes and watch him limp with that bum leg he got.  And women…those self-righteous twats have been preaching correctness all our lives...serves ‘em right, Megyn Kelly.

That’s the fire under Donald Trump.  Anybody got a better theory about what PC is?  Or what Donald Trump is saying?

Tommy Monk wrote:

Nems, I have noticed how honest you are when agreeing with me... why do the other lefties deny what I say and then accuse me of SIXHIRB for daring to mention things...!!!???


THINGS THAT ARE TRUE!!!???

What is SIXHIRB?

A made up concept by those who wish to protect their prejducie views.

Nems wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:

Nems, I have noticed how honest you are when agreeing with me... why do the other lefties deny what I say and then accuse me of SIXHIRB for daring to mention things...!!!???


THINGS THAT ARE TRUE!!!???

What is SIXHIRB?

Sexist, intolerant, xenophobic, homophobic, Islamophobic, racist, bigoted.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Nems wrote:

What is SIXHIRB?

Sexist, intolerant, xenophobic, homophobic, Islamophobic, racist, bigoted.

Lol 7 stereotypes for the price of one!

Cuchulain wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:
It was pc driven agenda throughout all the public services/councils/police...


Widely publicised... plus how the Muslims in council positions also actively worked to cover it up and suppress any action...

Again in all the cases whether it be care homes, politicians, celebrities, grooming gangs, there is one factor that is relevant in all.
None of the victims claims were taken seriously.
That is the failing and it has nothing to do with PC as the source of the problem has always been where many have not believed the victims

Anyway back to the debate

It was the very culture created by PCs that meant these ,matters were not persued and these children were not believed. Histical sexual abuse differs in cases where the perp was famous, they were untouchable. I firmly believe though that PCs has contributed a great deal to racism and appeasement and let an awful lot of people down.

Nems wrote:It was the very culture created by PCs that meant these ,matters were not persued and these children were not believed. Histical sexual abuse differs in cases where the perp was famous, they were untouchable. I firmly believe though that PCs has contributed a great deal to racism and appeasement and let an awful lot of people down.

Again you are avoding the main point in all cases where the victim has been let down.
Its because they are not having their claim taken seriously.
If their claim is taken seriously then and if then the Police do not act you could claim PC, but that is not the case, they never took the claims seriously from the start, as was the same with many in social services, not all but many did not.

No it wasn't down to claims not being taken seriously as it was widely known what was going on but just the public services were willfully neglecting to do anything because it would make Paki Muslims look bad!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:No it wasn't down to claims not being taken seriously as it was widely known what was going on but just the public services were willfully neglecting to do anything because it would make Paki Muslims look bad!!!

Really, you can back that up then that many of the victims claims would have been taken seriously then?
No they were not and they were not believed, which is where the problem stems.
You see its racial for you by your last remark.
If people are not acting according to the law, they have failed to the victims and they failed the victims by not taken their claims seriously

Cuchulain wrote:

Nems wrote:It was the very culture created by PCs that meant these ,matters were not persued and these children were not believed. Histical sexual abuse differs in cases where the perp was famous, they were untouchable. I firmly believe though that PCs has contributed a great deal to racism and appeasement and let an awful lot of people down.

Again you are avoding the main point in all cases where the victim has been let down.
Its because they are not having their claim taken seriously.
If their claim is taken seriously then and if then the Police do not act you could claim PC, but that is not the case, they never took the claims seriously from the start, as was the same with many in social services, not all but many did not.

Yes it is because of all the things you say - and those things you say happened because of PC and perhaps social workers etc not wishing to offend ie being too PC?

eddie wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:


Again you are avoding the main point in all cases where the victim has been let down.
Its because they are not having their claim taken seriously.
If their claim is taken seriously then and if then the Police do not act you could claim PC, but that is not the case, they never took the claims seriously from the start, as was the same with many in social services, not all but many did not.

Yes it is because of all the things you say - and those things you say happened because of PC and perhaps social workers etc not wishing to offend ie being too PC?

Really so with Jimmy Saville etc it was because of PC that the victims claims were not taken seriously then?

Victims claims were taken seriously but just not acted upon because of the insidious pc agenda that permeates public services, councils and the police.

Tommy Monk wrote:Victims claims were taken seriously but just not acted upon because of the insidious pc agenda that permeates public services, councils and the police.

Really, they were taken seriously by not acting on countless times and not just here but countless other cases not involving grooming gangs.
You are talking bollocks as have you read many of the accounts of the victims where they clearly say their claims were not taken seriously

Cuchulain wrote:

eddie wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:


Again you are avoding the main point in all cases where the victim has been let down.
Its because they are not having their claim taken seriously.
If their claim is taken seriously then and if then the Police do not act you could claim PC, but that is not the case, they never took the claims seriously from the start, as was the same with many in social services, not all but many did not.

Yes it is because of all the things you say - and those things you say happened because of PC and perhaps social workers etc not wishing to offend ie being too PC?

Really so with Jimmy Saville etc it was because of PC that the victims claims were not taken seriously then?

He was white

eddie wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:


Really so with Jimmy Saville etc it was because of PC that the victims claims were not taken seriously then?

He was white

And?

"...Political correctness and fear of appearing racist stopped council speaking out against Pakistani community..."

(Pc and fear of appearing racist are both the same thing!!!)


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2939129/Two-local-councillors-corrupt-police-officer-accused-having-sex-victims-Rotherham-abuse-scandal.html


Widely reported dodge... stop lying by denying!!!

Yeah that is the daily mail.
Whoopdedoo.
My points still stand on the victims which share the same failing no matter the countless cases not involving grooming gangs.

Dodge... everyone knows what I say is true as it has been very widely reported!!!


It is even mentioned in the professor jay report and the Wikipedia page on the subject!!!


Anyone can Google "Muslim grooming gangs failure act political correctness" and find countless links confirming exactly what I have said!!!


Why are you lying about this dodge...!!!???

Twatty, you are avoiding my points as per usual.
The first and foremost failing was not taken the claims of the victims seriously.
If the council did not act because it feared they would be labbelled racists, then that is no excuse either or the fault of PC, it is their fault for not acting. As how is PC to blame fopr them not doing what was correct?
Its a copout excuse to blame PC when it is individuals not acting in the council

Cuchulain wrote:

Nems wrote:It was the very culture created by PCs that meant these ,matters were not persued and these children were not believed. Histical sexual abuse differs in cases where the perp was famous, they were untouchable. I firmly believe though that PCs has contributed a great deal to racism and appeasement and let an awful lot of people down.

Again you are avoding the main point in all cases where the victim has been let down.
Its because they are not having their claim taken seriously.
If their claim is taken seriously then and if then the Police do not act you could claim PC, but that is not the case, they never took the claims seriously from the start, as was the same with many in social services, not all but many did not.

And why do you think that was?

Nems wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:


Again you are avoding the main point in all cases where the victim has been let down.
Its because they are not having their claim taken seriously.
If their claim is taken seriously then and if then the Police do not act you could claim PC, but that is not the case, they never took the claims seriously from the start, as was the same with many in social services, not all but many did not.

And why do you think that was?

Because they did not beleieve the victims, whether it be with many sexual abuse claims
Its not something new with grooming gangs, you do realise that?

Dodge... the pc agenda of bending over backwards to show certain groups in only the best and most positive of lights (special treatment for only some, all in the name of fairness and equality mind) is the same now as it was then and has been for nearly 20 years!!!


Everything I've said is true and proven with evidence!!!


Two more recent examples...


Firstly your thead on that Muslim woman allowing her children to play on railway platform and child nearly getting killed by train when strayed onto track was twisted into a story about a heroic burkha clad Muslim woman passer by who rescued an unrelated innocent child in an act of complete greatness...


Second was a news piece couple days ago about round the world yacht race setting off from London, 25 or so boats and crew, and how most of those taking part were totally inexperienced volunteers who have given up a year to do... which was then turned straight into an interview of one of these crew members... and guess what...???


But straight to the token brown skinned Muslim headscarf wearing woman who immediately started banging on about how great it was being a Muslim etc etc and how she was not just a headscarf etc...



Just two examples of constant bias and media spin on anything and everything Muslim these days!!!



Is a bloody joke!!!

More poor excuses and still not actually countering my points.
If people use a poor excuse they did not act through a fear of a label, then they are at fault not PC. They would be no cause to claim racism, so their fears were un justified. They failed to act when the evidence was damning with the council.
This still fails to understand the primary cause of concern that in countless sexual abuse cases the victims claims are not taken seriously.
So again how is PC to blame when it is just a concept?
It is people who act and people who fail and those backing their excuses are as poor as they are.

"...Political correctness and fear of appearing racist..."



Stop lying by denying dodge!!!

the point with rotherham and bradford etc is that the PC lobby had and still has created an atmosphere of fear amongst even the authorities....how deeply this is entrenched of course id demonstrated by the fact that those who sought to bring these things to light WERE threatened with being charged with trumped up charges of "attempting to cause racial hatered" etc...

and as evidence you only have to look at the experience of Nick griffen.....who was so threatened....for doing just that.

ok so the guy is a washed out has been....

but this was what 12 years ago.....

SO yes whilst PC by its definition is harmless enough, and even laudable...the reality is something else entirely.....

Didge you can quote dictionary definitions till te cows come home, but when the reality of useage is different to the definition but the name is the same, then we have a problem....

PC has been turned into "newspeak" by the lefty.....and perverted in its purpose....but retained the name as a disguise.....

Oh and note how subtly the focus has been removed from the uncomfortable facts of rotherham etc....and burried under an avalanch of wrong doing by (note) white, prominent people....

not that these whte prominent people should get away with anything BUT......listen carefuly....not a sausage about rotherham bradford etc etc etc.......all quitely burried and hidden away under an artificially created media storm over "historical" abuse claims" ...few of which will EVER be actually proveable beyond any degree of acceptability. yet those that happened a few years ago...have been carfully "lost".

Again you cannot answer my questions and points.
You are excusing peoples failings based off a concept and cannot explain
Stop wasting my time if you cannot answer

Again even Victor fails and looks to excuse peoples failings to a concept?
He is also trying to excuse people for their wrong actions.
PC when used correctly does not allow for confliction where this is confliction because those in authoroity failed the victims.
They did so off poor fear, where that fear was not warranted
Again you can offer no arguiment when PC is used as it is meant to be used as its intentions are to stop prejudice.
People failing to believe real victims is not the fault of the concept of PC but people failing to act themselves.

I've proved what I said is true... so is beyond your waffle about points and questions dodge...!!!

You have not proved anything but to continue excusing people

Waffle...

Show me in the PC concept where it states to break the law or cover for people breaking the law?

On that note I shall leave you to ponder why you have been wrong throughout.

Night

Well dodge... it happened for over a decade with the Paki Muslim child rape gangs being allowed to operate with impunity... not just in one or two instances... but throughout the UK!!!

Yes it happened for decades with celebrities got away where their victims claims were not taken seriously.
You failed again to answer.

Show me in the PC concept where it states to break the law or cover for people breaking the law?

The concept is fine, sadly people in some cases are not fine and get things wrong, which is why your view is flawed. PC does not call on people to protect criminals.

Hopefully you will have a better answer tomorrow, but I doubt it.

Bye

Widespread collective behaviour dodge...


Stop lying by denying!!!

Copout

Try again

Show me in the PC concept where it states to break the law or cover for people breaking the law?

So this widespread collective behaviour to actively cover up and suppress was driven by what...!?

Cuchulain wrote:Again even Victor fails and looks to excuse peoples failings to a concept?
He is also trying to excuse people for their wrong actions.
PC when used correctly does not allow for confliction where this is confliction because those in authoroity failed the victims.
They did so off poor fear, where that fear was not warranted
Again you can offer no arguiment when PC is used as it is meant to be used as its intentions are to stop prejudice.
People failing to believe real victims is not the fault of the concept of PC but people failing to act themselves.

what YOU fail to understand is that we are talking about people, not robots. Those involved were in little doubt as to the fate of anyone upsetting the apple cart so to speak. As I said even Griffen was threatened...
People can only be expected to act correctly in an atmosphere which promotes "correct action" rather than one which promotes "dont rock the boat"

PC created the conditions where it was at least on a personal level far safer to keep your head down (and your job) than speak out, be silenced and in all likely hood be sacked and disgraced as a racist

the individulas involved were almost certainly isolated by distrust of one another, and a lack of support from the top....

the "top" wasnt saying anything and indeed was complicit in silence for exactly the same reasons....It was the only safe course....

You cannot blame the people and at the same time hold the (however wrongly used) concept of PC blameless....

the left have an agenda and those poor kids are considered less than "colateral damage" .....as I said ...look how its being quietly buried....

oh and tommy is wrong too.....

it wasnt "collective behaviour" in the sense that there was overt collusion

it was more "herd behaviour" in the face of a perceived threat....

remember group psychology didge...

a group can act "cohesively" WITHOUT direct communication between members...simply by its members observing the behaviour of other members....and taking their group behaviour cues from that......

hmmm...the name for such "behavioural communication" escapes me ATM.......any ideas?

Victor excusing people again
Created the conditions?
What for people to excuse people committing crimes?
What a load of bullshit.
It did nothing of the sort, it is there to prevent discrmination, not laws being broken, so the people failed in thic regard as again there is nothing in the concept for people to excuse those who do wrong
I can blame the people which you are disgustiungly looking to excuse
There was no case for them to fear racism, because there clearly was evidence of crimes being committed. To say they feared racism being labbellled was their failing
Sorry you are talking utter crock here Victor, and excusing people for the worst failings.

victorismyhero wrote:oh and tommy is wrong too.....

it wasnt "collective behaviour" in the sense that there was overt collusion

it was more "herd behaviour" in the face of a perceived threat....

remember group psychology didge...

a group can act "cohesively" WITHOUT direct communication between members...simply by its members observing the behaviour of other members....and taking their group behaviour cues from that......

hmmm...the name for such "behavioural communication" escapes me ATM.......any ideas?

That does make sense actually

They were all collectively following the same agenda... as instructed from above...



Many did raise issues with superiors only to have them enforce silence through waving of the pc stick and then actively pursued the collective cover up!!!

There was a collective failing by some.
They are at fault for not acting and yet some here wish to excuse that.
The superiors were the ones in the wrong.
Not PC

All following the pc agenda... as instructed to them... how could so many behave in this same way up and down the country without this behaviour being followed by each as instructed...?


If a mistake by some in some places then this would have been overruled by the many in most places...


But what we do know is that some in some places spoke out and raised concerns but were the ones told they were wrong!!!

People created their own agenda here, one which PC did not create.
They created and wrongly protected criminals

Waffle...

Go and have one if you have that on your mind to eat

Cuchulain wrote:Victor excusing people again
Created the conditions?
What for people to excuse people committing crimes?
What a load of bullshit.
It did nothing of the sort, it is there to prevent discrmination, not laws being broken, so the people failed in thic regard as again there is nothing in the concept for people to excuse those who do wrong
I can blame the people which you are disgustiungly looking to excuse

I'm NOT excusing them...I consider them pathetic and weak, spineless individuals who buckled under threat, rather than setting out to expose what was going on...but I also understand human weakness....not everyone has as vicious "I dont give a shit attitude as me" and not everyone is prepared to pull the roof down upon everyone involved regardless....

There was no case for them to fear racism, because there clearly was evidence of crimes being committed.

I dont disagree in the main, HOWEVER how much easier is it to stay silent and keep your job than take on the system and risk it?

To say they feared racism being labbellled was their failing


true , but again...given the evidence of their own eyes, and the "whispered weasle words" "dont rock the boat chief" are you REALLY surprised...
Sorry you are talking utter crock here Victor, and excusing people for the worst failings.

NOW of course THIS means that somewhere...very high up, in a position to make that "dont rock the boat" threat, lies the true evil.

but...what is the weapon they are using........PC.

is PC inherently bad.....no
is a gun inherently bad....no

can both be used by the ill intentioned to do harm

yes

in civilised nations are guns controlled......yes (never mind america...they aint civilised )

but PC......???????????????????????????????
perhaps the dictionary definition of PC should be "enforced" (dont ask me how) and its boundaries set.....then a bit of faith could perhaps be reinstated in to it......
as it is its both a danger and a laughing stock....

can you remember the "secret cheese party" sketch from monty python.....

I wouldnt mind betting that there are arties of friends who get together deliberately to tell UN-PC jokes.....just to stick 2 fingers up to the PC culture......

Again you are excusing people that created this situation
PC did not create it, idiots did
Anyway I have no mood to get in deaph tonight as I am being distracted by the forum harpies lol
So you will have to forgive me mate

Huge numbers of people throughout the UK in various towns and cities and various public service organisations, ALL FOLLOWED THE SAME AGENDA!!!

DEALING WITH HARPIES

harpies tend to attack in swarms and are ranged magic users
to combat them you will need ranged combat specialists in your party, like demonic wralocks, fire or frost mages, ranger/hunter or vengeance druids types are also very good at combating these menaces to the honest traveler.

It is inadvisable for tanks to engage these characters unless accompanied by a healer such as a priest, or preferably a restoration druid (due to the ability of resto druids to make large heals instantly and also keep up a constant low level heal on the go over time) It should be noted that holy paladins are NOT a good choice of healer for harpie encounters due to their inability to sustain constant heals over time.

It should also be remembered that armor level is largely irrelevant unless you have high level armor that is magic resistant.

all potions and buffs should be used when and as available

for WOW players death knights are an excellent choice for use against harpies, their anti magic buffs and abilities coupled with their ability to self heal makes them a formidable defence against harpie incursions.


taken from a gaming book