Why do dumb people think they are so smart? Science proves this is true.

It is a proven fact that dumb people think they are smarter than they actually are. It's called the Dunning–Kruger effect:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect&oldid=612847043

Dunning and Kruger proposed that, for a given skill, incompetent people will:

1) tend to overestimate their own level of skill;
2) fail to recognize genuine skill in others;
3) fail to recognize the extremity of their inadequacy;
4) recognize and acknowledge their own previous lack of skill, if they are exposed to training for that skill.



Conversely, intelligent people tend toward underestimating their abilities and overestimating others' abilities.

 

This hypothetical proposal (not a "proven fact" - despite Tess's obvious wish that it was !) goes a long way to explaining the arrogant behaviour of some of the more rampant bigots on this forum...

Namely:  Tommy Monks, smellybum' and Big Andy himself..    

Lone Wolf wrote: 

This hypothetical proposal (not a "proven fact" - despite Tess's obvious wish that it was !) goes a long way to explaining the arrogant behaviour of some of the more rampant bigots on this forum...

Namely:  Tommy Monks, smellybum' and Big Andy himself..    

Well I've never heard any of them bragging about their intelligence. You, on the other hand... Didge...

Tesstacious wrote:It is a proven fact that dumb people think they are smarter than they actually are. It's called the Dunning–Kruger effect:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect&oldid=612847043

Dunning and Kruger proposed that, for a given skill, incompetent people will:

1) tend to overestimate their own level of skill;
2) fail to recognize genuine skill in others;
3) fail to recognize the extremity of their inadequacy;
4) recognize and acknowledge their own previous lack of skill, if they are exposed to training for that skill.



Conversely, intelligent people tend toward underestimating their abilities and overestimating others' abilities.

I knew someone like that once. She had an amazing confidence in her own abilities, which she didn't really live up to. Still, it did mean that she was confident, and she didn't seem to mind when she got things wrong. I rather liked her.   

Are they better off believing they are inferior?

We hear so much about, Be all that you can be.  This appears to be the contrary message.  Be nothing, and make the world a better place.

Most of these people are Tories and Republicans, anyway.  You have to be duped in order to believe the trash they believe.  It does prove what John Stuart Mill proposed as fact: "I never said all conservatives are stupid; I said all stupid people are conservative."

Original Quill wrote:Are they better off believing they are inferior?

We hear so much about, Be all that you can be.  This appears to be the contrary message.  Be nothing, and make the world a better place.

Most of these people are Tories and Republicans, anyway.  You have to be duped in order to believe the trash they believe.  It does prove what John Stuart Mill proposed as fact: "I never said all conservatives are stupid; I said all stupid people are conservative."

"Arguing with liberals is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over all the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around the table looking victorious."

You obviously don't speak pigeon, do you?  ::D:: 

Really Tess? You've never heard Smelly espousing how well educated he is in matters of Islam or how intelligent he is compared to others? I suppose since you probably agree with smelly on many things you tend to miss his relentless self glorification lol

Original Quill wrote:You obviously don't speak pigeon, do you?   ::D:: 

Have a PhD in it old chap.  

http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Pigeon_Sounds_clips

Eilzel wrote:Really Tess? You've never heard Smelly espousing how well educated he is in matters of Islam or how intelligent he is compared to others? I suppose since you probably agree with smelly on many things you tend to miss his relentless self glorification lol

You're getting very embittered in your old age mate. I mentioned Lonely and Didge because they're the only ones that say they're genuises in EVERYTHING.

Tesstacious wrote:

Original Quill wrote:You obviously don't speak pigeon, do you?   ::D:: 

Have a PhD in it old chap.  

http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Pigeon_Sounds_clips

I said pigeon...not pidg'n-english.   

Well Tess you did say above 'you've never heard any of them' (andy, tommy and smelly) bragging about their intelligence. I'm not being bitter Tess, but you do like to paint fallacious pictures. I know you don't like those two, much like I don't like monk or smelly, but it is hypocritical to explicitly say people aren't a certain way when they are just because they are on your 'side'. Nothing to do with my (old?) age hahaha x

Isn't it Lone Wolf who keeps banging on about how clever he is? He often mentions his "qualifications" too.

Eilzel wrote:Well Tess you did say above 'you've never heard any of them' (andy, tommy and smelly) bragging about their intelligence. I'm not being bitter Tess, but you do like to paint fallacious pictures. I know you don't like those two, much like I don't like monk or smelly, but it is hypocritical to explicitly say people aren't a certain way when they are just because they are on your 'side'. Nothing to do with my (old?) age hahaha x

You're not getting the point.  Yes some posters claim to be EXPERTS in certain subjects - that's totally different to people just saying how INTELLIGENT they are, generally, on everything.

People who brag are rarely anything much to brag about IMO.

Raggamuffin wrote:Isn't it Lone Wolf who keeps banging on about how clever he is? He often mentions his "qualifications" too.

No...I've never heard that from him.

I've known him for many years, and he is qualified in agriculture and related sciences. He also has additional studies (degrees?) in environmental matters, and he is most informative in the area of conservation. That's the only field I've ever heard him pull rank on some less-prepared posters.

Other than that, he just uses good reasoning.

Raggamuffin wrote:
Isn't it Lone Wolf who keeps banging on about how clever he is? He often mentions his "qualifications" too.

  

STOP your rabid lies, Ragg's...

YOU only embarrass yourself further each time you make false allegations against others on here..

eddie wrote:
People who brag are rarely anything much to brag about IMO.

  

MUST be well past time that you stopped your endless boasting in that case, eddie...

Tesstacious wrote:...............

 Yes some posters claim to be EXPERTS in certain subjects - that's totally different to people just saying how INTELLIGENT they are, generally, on everything...

  

I BELIEVE that you, Raggs' and eddie are the only people on here who are imagining that phenomenon !

Tesstacious wrote:

Lone Wolf wrote:
 

This hypothetical proposal (not a "proven fact" - despite Tess's obvious wish that it was !) goes a long way to explaining the arrogant behaviour of some of the more rampant bigots on this forum...

Namely:  Tommy Monks, smellybum' and Big Andy himself..    

Well I've never heard any of them bragging about their intelligence.  You, on the other hand... Didge...

 

YOU really must get past your "selective deafness and blindness", Tess'...

IT IS most unbecoming for a gal' of your self-declared brilliance..

"There are none so blind as those who refuse to see."

Lone Wolf wrote:

Tesstacious wrote:
Well I've never heard any of them bragging about their intelligence.  You, on the other hand... Didge...

 

YOU really must get past your "selective deafness and blindness", Tess'...

IT IS most unbecoming for a gal' of your self-declared brilliance..

"There are none so blind as those who refuse to see."

I dare anyone to find any post where I've 'self-declared any brilliance' - I abhore vanity, my vain little peacock...

Tesstacious wrote:
Dunning and Kruger proposed that, for a given skill, incompetent people will:

1) tend to overestimate their own level of skill;
2) fail to recognize genuine skill in others;
3) fail to recognize the extremity of their inadequacy;
4) recognize and acknowledge their own previous lack of skill, if they are exposed to training for that skill.

Conversely, intelligent people tend toward underestimating their abilities and overestimating others' abilities.

 

I KNOW that I can be a bit thick at times, but it seems from the above, that:

1. Going by her own guidelines, Tess should be considered as being "dumb" and "incompetent"  !?!

2. Tommy, smelly' and Big Andy should be considered as the resident geniuses of this forum, going by Tess's new reverse rationale (confirmed in her earlier comments) !

3. While those people that many of us may have previously considered as often showing some evidence of "above average" intelligence on here ~ for example, the likes of: Quill, lovedust, KD, Victor, Didge, Stardesk, veya, Elizel, FTL, Irn Bru, Sexy Momma, Ben, Nems, Cass ~ should now somehow be considered as the dolts and clods of Tess, eddie and Raggs's parallel universe..    

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:Isn't it Lone Wolf who keeps banging on about how clever he is? He often mentions his "qualifications" too.

No...I've never heard that from him.

I've known him for many years, and he is qualified in agriculture and related sciences.  He also has additional studies (degrees?) in environmental matters, and he is most informative in the area of conservation.  That's the only field I've ever heard him pull rank on some less-prepared posters.

Other than that, he just uses good reasoning.

Oh he does pull rank. He constantly tells some people they're stupid and then brags about his "qualifications", thereby implying that he's much more intelligent than them.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

No...I've never heard that from him.

I've known him for many years, and he is qualified in agriculture and related sciences.  He also has additional studies (degrees?) in environmental matters, and he is most informative in the area of conservation.  That's the only field I've ever heard him pull rank on some less-prepared posters.

Other than that, he just uses good reasoning.

Oh he does pull rank. He constantly tells some people they're stupid and then brags about his "qualifications", thereby implying that he's much more intelligent than them.

About a year ago, maybe less, Lil Andy started a 'hate' thread on this board, aimed at 'bullying' Bee.  Many of you jumped on that band wagon.  Do you know what it's like to be the victim of a bully?  It's not a warm, fuzzy feeling and and it leaves a lasting memory.

Before y'all devote so much time and effort to perpetuating hate in the world, you might try the opposite.  In the meantime, I understand Bee. Or take a page from Nems, LD or FTL...you never saw them bullying Bee, or anyone, did you?  They are the true leaders on this site.

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Oh he does pull rank. He constantly tells some people they're stupid and then brags about his "qualifications", thereby implying that he's much more intelligent than them.

About a year ago, maybe less, Lil Andy started a 'hate' thread on this board, aimed at 'bullying' Bee.  Many of you jumped on that band wagon.  Do you know what it's like to be the victim of a bully?  It's not a warm, fuzzy feeling and and it leaves a lasting memory.

Before y'all devote so much time and effort to perpetuating hate in the world, you might try the opposite.  In the meantime, I understand Bee. Or take a page from Nems, LD or FTL...you never saw them bullying Bee, or anyone, did you?  They are the true leaders on this site.

I wasn't even here a year ago, and I don't think most members were, so stop pointing the finger.

Lone Wolf spends most of his time on here abusing people for no apparent reason.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

About a year ago, maybe less, Lil Andy started a 'hate' thread on this board, aimed at 'bullying' Bee.  Many of you jumped on that band wagon.  Do you know what it's like to be the victim of a bully?  It's not a warm, fuzzy feeling and and it leaves a lasting memory.

Before y'all devote so much time and effort to perpetuating hate in the world, you might try the opposite.  In the meantime, I understand Bee. Or take a page from Nems, LD or FTL...you never saw them bullying Bee, or anyone, did you?  They are the true leaders on this site.

I wasn't even here a year ago, and I don't think most members were, so stop pointing the finger.

Lone Wolf spends most of his time on here abusing people for no apparent reason.

That's not true. You were here, as were most members. Lots will remember the thread.

lone wolf loves to abuse posters, especialy woman,he gets a thrill out of it!!

nicko wrote:lone wolf loves to abuse posters, especialy  woman,he gets a thrill out of it!!

More stirring.

Telling the truth is stirring is it?

nicko wrote:lone wolf loves to abuse posters, especialy  woman,he gets a thrill out of it!!

I don't think so.  He is a bit obsessive when it comes to RW'ers, but you should have seen some of the cyber battles we have been in.  Lovedust will remember.

Speaking of LD, Bee considers her one of his best of friends.  She is every bit a female member, and actually gets along famously with some that Bee doesn't.  Surprise.  Surprise...lol.

nicko wrote:Telling the truth is stirring is it?

Shit stirring again

Now who's stirring you fucking idiot. You make me swear at your stupidity.

nicko wrote:Now who's stirring you fucking idiot. You make me swear at your stupidity.

More shit stirring, the proof is in the pudding!

Just got to have the last word haven't you?

nicko wrote:Just got to have the last word haven't you?

 ://?roflmao?/:  ://?roflmao?/:  ://?roflmao?/:

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I wasn't even here a year ago, and I don't think most members were, so stop pointing the finger.

Lone Wolf spends most of his time on here abusing people for no apparent reason.

That's not true.  You were here, as were most members.  Lots will remember the thread.

I joined in February this year ...

You do realise your making your self look a right childish prat, that's my last word see if you can make it yours

nicko wrote:You do realise your making your self look a right childish prat, that's my last word see if you can make it yours

More proof of your shit stirring, you just cannot help yourself it seems.

Didge wrote:

nicko wrote:

lone wolf loves to abuse posters, especialy  woman,he gets a thrill out of it!!

More stirring.

  

nicko has always been a lying old troll...

He and Tommy have both been targeting and harassing certain members non-stop on here since their joining...

Those two are quite obsessed with attacking those more moderate or opposite to their own fascist, racist and xenophobic ideals.

YOUR UNBELIEVABLE.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

About a year ago, maybe less, Lil Andy started a 'hate' thread on this board, aimed at 'bullying' Bee.  Many of you jumped on that band wagon.  Do you know what it's like to be the victim of a bully?  It's not a warm, fuzzy feeling and and it leaves a lasting memory.

Before y'all devote so much time and effort to perpetuating hate in the world, you might try the opposite.  In the meantime, I understand Bee. Or take a page from Nems, LD or FTL...you never saw them bullying Bee, or anyone, did you?  They are the true leaders on this site.

I wasn't even here a year ago, and I don't think most members were, so stop pointing the finger.

Lone Wolf spends most of his time on here abusing people for no apparent reason.

  

YOU'RE nothing more than a lying piece of crap, Raggs' ~ plain enough for anyone with eyes to see !!!


I have never attacked anyone for no reason ~

EVERY "attack" by me against you, Tess, eddie, and VOD&heavenly has been in clear and obvious retaliation against you either attacking me, or one or more of my "forum friends" on here;

EVERY "attack" against Tommy, smelly', nicko' and B'Andy is in retaliation and/or defence against their ongoing onslaughts against their declared "enemies" on here..

I HAVE never initiated or instigated any attacks against any of you.


Tess, with the obvious assistance of YOU and eddie, however, have clearly and openly started this hatemongering attack thread here today ~ for the sole purpose of starting afresh with targeted abuse, troublemaking and stirring against me, Didge, and anyone else like Quill, Philagain or Elizel who may bother to comment on your shenanigans now or in the future.

WHY do you three dried up old flophead ladies choose to carry so much hatred for your fellow human beings on here, BaggsOfMuffins ???  

Lone Wolf wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I wasn't even here a year ago, and I don't think most members were, so stop pointing the finger.

Lone Wolf spends most of his time on here abusing people for no apparent reason.

  

YOU'RE nothing more than a lying piece of crap, Raggs' ~ plain enough for anyone with eyes to see !!!


I have never attacked anyone for no reason ~

EVERY "attack" by me against you, Tess, eddie, and VOD&heavenly has been in clear and obvious retaliation against you either attacking me, or one or more of my "forum friends" on here;

EVERY "attack" against Tommy, smelly', nicko' and B'Andy is in retaliation and/or defence against their ongoing onslaughts  against their declared "enemies" on here..

I HAVE never initiated or instigated any attacks against any of you.


Tess, with the obvious assistance of YOU and eddie, however, have clearly and openly started this hatemongering attack thread here today ~ for the sole purpose of starting afresh with targeted abuse, troublemaking and stirring against me, Didge, and anyone else like Quill, Philagain or Elizel who may bother to comment on your shenanigans now or in the future.

WHY do you three dried up old flophead ladies choose to carry so much hatred for your fellow human beings on here,  BaggsOfMuffins ???    

See my signature? You accused me straight after I joined of not being "real". You have attacked me many times, with no provocation whatsoever. This thread was nothing to do with me - you're lying.

Oh, and I've never been a member of Flap either.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

No...I've never heard that from him.

I've known him for many years, and he is qualified in agriculture and related sciences.  He also has additional studies (degrees?) in environmental matters, and he is most informative in the area of conservation.  That's the only field I've ever heard him pull rank on some less-prepared posters.

Other than that, he just uses good reasoning.

Oh he does pull rank. He constantly tells some people they're stupid and then brags about his "qualifications", thereby implying that he's much more intelligent than them.

Absolutely.
But he's got to have something to brag about.

Lone Wolf wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I wasn't even here a year ago, and I don't think most members were, so stop pointing the finger.

Lone Wolf spends most of his time on here abusing people for no apparent reason.

  

YOU'RE nothing more than a lying piece of crap, Raggs' ~ plain enough for anyone with eyes to see !!!


I have never attacked anyone for no reason ~

EVERY "attack" by me against you, Tess, eddie, and VOD&heavenly has been in clear and obvious retaliation against you either attacking me, or one or more of my "forum friends" on here;

EVERY "attack" against Tommy, smelly', nicko' and B'Andy is in retaliation and/or defence against their ongoing onslaughts  against their declared "enemies" on here..

I HAVE never initiated or instigated any attacks against any of you.


Tess, with the obvious assistance of YOU and eddie, however, have clearly and openly started this hatemongering attack thread here today ~ for the sole purpose of starting afresh with targeted abuse, troublemaking and stirring against me, Didge, and anyone else like Quill, Philagain or Elizel who may bother to comment on your shenanigans now or in the future.

WHY do you three dried up old flophead ladies choose to carry so much hatred for your fellow human beings on here,  BaggsOfMuffins ???    

HOW OLD ARE YOU?????

Grow the fuck up. Jesus Christ.

All I've ever done on here is speak the truth and give my honest opinions.
I have also always been able to argue my points and provide evidence and logical reasoning in support.
Those unable to successfully argue against things I've said have resorted to insults, questioning my intelligence, knowledge and ability, or by just using the regular leftie SIXHIRB style put downs.
And flea keeper has never even dared to once engage in debate attempting to prove anything I've ever said here to be wrong, but instead just pops up every now and then declaring how wrong I am without any evidence or argument at all.
Regards to The op, most people will only understand intelligence by the confines of their own limited capacity.
And most people will think they are at the peak of intelligence because they cannot truly comprehend what a higher level of intelligence really feels like.
I think some people will find it harder to learn things That other more intelligent people will grasp much more easily so maybe they then have a bigger sense of achievement and view this achievement as being a bigger badge of honour than it might really be worthy of?
"...

Tommy Monk wrote:All I've ever done on here is speak the truth and give my honest opinions.
I have also always been able to argue my points and provide evidence and logical reasoning in support.
Those unable to successfully argue against things I've said have resorted to insults, questioning my intelligence, knowledge and ability, or by just using the regular leftie SIXHIRB style put downs.
And flea keeper has never even dared to once engage in debate attempting to prove anything I've ever said here to be wrong, but instead just pops up every now and then declaring how wrong I am without any evidence or argument at all.
Regards to The op, most people will only understand intelligence by the confines of their own limited capacity.
And most people will think they are at the peak of intelligence because they cannot truly comprehend what a higher level of intelligence really feels like.
I think some people will find it harder to learn things That other more intelligent people will grasp much more easily so maybe they then have a bigger sense of achievement and view this achievement as being a bigger badge of honour than it might really be worthy of?
"...

Good post Matt.

(Ordered the curry stuff that I didn't have, will cook it Wednesday probably and will let you know later this week how it was!)

Tommy Monk wrote:All I've ever done on here is speak the truth and give my honest opinions.
I have also always been able to argue my points and provide evidence and logical reasoning in support.
Those unable to successfully argue against things I've said have resorted to insults, questioning my intelligence, knowledge and ability, or by just using the regular leftie SIXHIRB style put downs.
And flea keeper has never even dared to once engage in debate attempting to prove anything I've ever said here to be wrong, but instead just pops up every now and then declaring how wrong I am without any evidence or argument at all.
Regards to The op, most people will only understand intelligence by the confines of their own limited capacity.
And most people will think they are at the peak of intelligence because they cannot truly comprehend what a higher level of intelligence really feels like.
I think some people will find it harder to learn things That other more intelligent people will grasp much more easily so maybe they then have a bigger sense of achievement and view this achievement as being a bigger badge of honour than it might really be worthy of?
"...

I will agree that TM is pretty decent debater for the RW side when he  wants to be.... but what's with all the line breaks   

I think intelligent people understand how much they don't know.. also when you study to become an expert in something you realise it takes a lifetime and you still may not know everything about just the one thing you are an expert in (depending on the size and complexity of that thing). Part of that is also exposure because I am smart and got sent to a special school for the academically gifted I realise there are still people a lot Smarter than me because I went to school with them    I was 90%+ student at normal school without really trying   , I had to work to get 80% at the selective school   

I definitely agree with the last point. which sort of relates to a philosophical query I have had.  
Do people that are generally not good at stuff find it easier to stick at something when they do have some success with it?
Me and My sister in law were discussing it your see we both are the type of person that picks up a hobby easily get quite good at it (where people complement and we may even make some money) and then get bored and start a new hobby. So for example we can both play guitar but neither of us could stick to it long enough to get the whole 10,000 hours thing that they say you need to be an expert.    it takes that next level of commitment to go from 'good' to 'great' I just wonder if it is easier to make that commitment if you normally don't have success and people don't say your good at that and you find something that people say your good at. I used the example of guitar because we have a friend that is Great at guitar at first he was just 'good' (he got no more praise than me) but he is literally always playing it its been 15 years and he is still at it all the time... but he was sort of always just average at any anything else. So did that make it easier for him to stick at it and get the 10,000 hours thing     

Tesstacious wrote:

Original Quill wrote:Are they better off believing they are inferior?

We hear so much about, Be all that you can be.  This appears to be the contrary message.  Be nothing, and make the world a better place.

Most of these people are Tories and Republicans, anyway.  You have to be duped in order to believe the trash they believe.  It does prove what John Stuart Mill proposed as fact: "I never said all conservatives are stupid; I said all stupid people are conservative."

"Arguing with liberals is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over all the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around the table looking victorious."

my god...you have just described didge  :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: 

victorisnotamused wrote:

Tesstacious wrote:

"Arguing with liberals is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over all the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around the table looking victorious."

my god...you have just described didge  :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: :-:cawg:-: 

I am fab at chess, no doubt a Neo Nazi would try to fix the game, by having me blind folded, but will still win hands down, not knowing that I can feel the pieces and the positions of the board.


 ::happ::