NewsFix
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

5 posters

Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Didgee Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:26 pm

A black Democratic state representative from Illinois wants to ban the teaching of history in the state because it “leads to white privilege and a racist society.”

As reported by NBC Chicago, Rep. LaShawn Ford gave out a news release before a Sunday gathering of politicians and educators which asked the Illinois Board of Education and school districts to “immediately remove history curriculum and books that ‘unfairly communicate’ history ‘until a suitable alternative is developed.'”

In place of history, Ford suggests more focus on civics and “ensuring students understand democratic processes.”

Ford also is sponsoring a bill which would mandate elementary schools teach about the civil rights movement.


https://www.thecollegefix.com/illinois-lawmaker-proposes-ban-on-history-classes-because-they-lead-to-a-racist-society/

What a complete fuckwit

Didgee
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 969
Join date : 2020-06-09

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Tommy Monk Mon Aug 10, 2020 3:08 pm





What a bell end...


Tommy Monk
Tommy Monk
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 26319
Join date : 2014-02-12

Didgee likes this post

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Fred Moletrousers Mon Aug 10, 2020 5:29 pm

I wonder whether it has dawned on this thicko that the development and progress of the civil rights movement and the evolution of democratic processes are both integral parts of a nation's, er, history?

The thought that this blinkered buffoon is part of his country's legislature is positively frightening.
Fred Moletrousers
Fred Moletrousers
MABEL, THE GREAT ZOG

Posts : 3315
Join date : 2014-01-23

Didgee likes this post

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Original Quill Mon Aug 10, 2020 5:36 pm

The title is deceptive and misleading.  The College Fix, source of this article, is an American conservative news website focused on higher education. It was created in 2011, "to groom young conservatives for careers in the news media by placing college students in internships with right-leaning publications."  The websight is linked to Trump appointee, US Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos, and has been accused “of misreporting their stories.”  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_College_Fix

Rep. Ford is not urging a "ban on history", but an adjustment to make the study of history more appropriate, and more correct.  It’s a paradigm shift.  We've faced these issues before in the history of education.

For example, we used to teach American Government by studying the Constitution.  But it was not very insightful as to "HOW" people behave politically.  It's like studying a road map, when the real question is why there are so many automobile accidents.  So, the discipline morphed into American Political Science…or simply American Civics.

Rep. Ford's point is: History that is taught through the prism of bias, even if the bias was an innocent mistake, still presents a distorted picture.  Imagine if Hitler had won the war, what English history would look like today.  German professors would have descended on British schools and taught about the Glorious Third Reich Revolution, instead of the Glorious Revolution of 1688.  Bias has its impact and the real challenge is to make it more reflective of reality.

I think what Rep, Ford is doing is simply urging an adjustment of history to reflect the truth.  It’s a paradigm shift.  We’ve had this discussion before, when Yale University shifted its core program in history from Western European History to World History.  It’s a shift over to what is true and relevant for people today.

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 59
Location : Northern California

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Didgee Mon Aug 10, 2020 6:46 pm

Fred Moletrousers wrote:I wonder whether it has dawned on this thicko that the development and progress of the civil rights movement and the evolution of democratic processes are both integral parts of a nation's, er, history?

The thought that this blinkered buffoon is part of his country's legislature is positively frightening.

Agreed Fred, its dimwits like this that never learn from history and clearly that is the case here

We learn the good and bad about history and to suggest learning history is what makes people racist, is utterly dimwitted as it gets

This idiot simple wants to control what is taught in history

Another mollycoddled numpty

Didgee
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 969
Join date : 2020-06-09

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Didgee Mon Aug 10, 2020 6:53 pm

State Rep. LaShawn Ford recently called for history classes to be halted in the state of Illinois “until a suitable alternative is developed.” Politicians and educators joined the representative in suburban Evanston on August 2nd, together announcing their initiative. From the outset, as an historian, I cringe at the thought – a recurring feeling for me these days –but as always, there are two sides to the story. On the one hand, Rep. Ford is correct, American history as it is taught today, is fraught with bias and limited perspective. At the same time, any alternative history would suffer from the same limitations.

History or Just Stories?

One need not have a Ph.D. in history to know that history is often contested and up for debate. The average teenager in the United States knows that their understanding of the history of Thanksgiving, for example, changes as they age. As a child they may have believed that the holiday represented an idyllic gathering of ‘Pilgrims’ and ‘Native-Americans,’ sharing corn and bread and turkey. As they age, however, they come to know that, in fact, such an incident never really occurred; rather, it is an “origin myth,” a tale we tell ourselves in order to ennoble our country and heritage.

Yet, there is a lesson to be learned here as well. There is an opportunity, a “teachable moment,” if applied correctly and fairly. What a child learns as becoming a young adult is that “origin myths” are everywhere and have a functional purpose. As someone with a Ph.D. in history I do reject the premise that the United States is particularly guilty of forging “origin myths.” All countries, all states that you now can find on a map were born of blood, fire and clash.

I am alarmed at the idea we stop teaching history to protect younger people from “origin myths;” and I am concerned we will simply replace one origin myth for another, while students mistakenly believe that the new history is purged of blemish. Rather history teachers must be critical guides, exposing students to history as it is inherited, while also providing alternatives that do not exclude. The general premise of history must be it is a contested narrative.

Who Has the Right to Write?

This initiative to cancel history classes until “an alternative” is decided upon in Chicago and the state is not novel or unprecedented. The movement has its origins in the “1619 Project” launched by the New York Times Magazine. Like all things the project has both good and bad; but the bad may outweigh the good in several ways.

The “1619 Project” is an ongoing project developed by The New York Times Magazine in 2019 with the goal to “reframe the country’s history by placing the consequences of slavery and the contributions of black Americans at the very center of our national narrative”. The Pulitzer Center describes the central aim of the project as a challenge “to reframe U.S. history by marking the year when the first enslaved Africans arrived on Virginia soil as our nation’s foundational date.”

Even though I do not believe the United States is unique in basking in its own origin myth, I do believe the US is unique in its history of slavery and the legacy it has imparted upon millions and millions of Americans. So, in this sense the impetus of the project is entirely understandable; the project also simply articulates other very bad versions of history.

It is not within the scope of this article to enter the fray of that discussion, I will simply draw your attention to The Atlantic and Politico for reviews of the debate.

My point is more philosophical. Who has the right to write? Basically, are we not all a product of our society and education? Who can claim, with absolute confidence, that they have transcended social constructs and narratives to such a degree that they are free of them and in possession of the truth?

I do believe there could be some advantages to being multi-cultural, multi-racial, multi-ethnic in the sense that your very being is exposed to various narratives and constructs, thus you are innately aware of their contingent nature.

But so long as some narratives are treated as simply evil and others pure, we will simply be exchanging one piece of propaganda for another.

https://chicagomonitor.com/2020/08/have-history-classes-just-been-cancelled-in-chicago/


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/12/historians-clash-1619-project/604093/

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/03/06/1619-project-new-york-times-mistake-122248

Didgee
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 969
Join date : 2020-06-09

Vintage likes this post

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Original Quill Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:11 pm

"Dimwits, idiot, mollycoddled, numpty?"  Adjectives are not arguments.

You are correct, Fred.  One of the things, I'm sure, that what Rep. Ford does not want to see is a revisionist history that excludes "progress of the civil rights movement and the evolution of democratic processes."  That subtle insight you raise shows us how absurd it is to label Ford’s efforts as "banning" history.

The OP suffers by not describing what changes are the ones Rep. Ford wants.  I assume the article wants to avoid such details, so it can fabricate a host of lies recasting his true efforts.

Fred, I think you are sniffing along the right trail.  You just have to go a little farther to find the real purpose of this article.

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 59
Location : Northern California

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Original Quill Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:40 pm

The article avoids inconvenient details as to the facts at issue, and proceeds rather to state:

College Fix wrote:My point is more philosophical. Who has the right to write? Basically, are we not all a product of our society and education? Who can claim, with absolute confidence, that they have transcended social constructs and narratives to such a degree that they are free of them and in possession of the truth?

So, this is an indirect attack on truth as a basis for teaching history.  Now that this is clear, we might observe that this is the German professor, noted above, who would recast the "Glorious Revolution of 1688" into the "Glorious Third Reich Revolution".  Anything goes, so the article says, who has the handle on truth?

The issue isn't the logic of such existential relativism, but what the people want?  Truth or indoctrination?.  Do people want their children to be taught truth, or do they want their children to be taught political indoctrination?  Do they want their schools to be actual learning centers, or do they want their schools to be North Korean Re-orientation Camps?  Rep. Ford sides with truth.

Truth in history is the lasting test.

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 59
Location : Northern California

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Didgee Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:54 pm

Didgee wrote:State Rep. LaShawn Ford recently called for history classes to be halted in the state of Illinois “until a suitable alternative is developed.” Politicians and educators joined the representative in suburban Evanston on August 2nd, together announcing their initiative.  From the outset, as an historian, I cringe at the thought – a recurring feeling for me these days –but as always, there are two sides to the story.  On the one hand, Rep. Ford is correct, American history as it is taught today, is fraught with bias and limited perspective.  At the same time, any alternative history would suffer from the same limitations.

History or Just Stories?

One need not have a Ph.D. in history to know that history is often contested and up for debate.  The average teenager in the United States knows that their understanding of the history of Thanksgiving, for example, changes as they age.  As a child they may have believed that the holiday represented an idyllic gathering of ‘Pilgrims’ and ‘Native-Americans,’ sharing corn and bread and turkey.  As they age, however, they come to know that, in fact, such an incident never really occurred; rather, it is an “origin myth,” a tale we tell ourselves in order to ennoble our country and heritage.  

Yet, there is a lesson to be learned here as well.  There is an opportunity, a “teachable moment,” if applied correctly and fairly.  What a child learns as becoming a young adult is that “origin myths” are everywhere and have a functional purpose.  As someone with a Ph.D. in history I do reject the premise that the United States is particularly guilty of forging “origin myths.”  All countries, all states that you now can find on a map were born of blood, fire and clash.  

I am alarmed at the idea we stop teaching history to protect younger people from “origin myths;” and I am concerned we will simply replace one origin myth for another, while students mistakenly believe that the new history is purged of blemish.  Rather history teachers must be critical guides, exposing students to history as it is inherited, while also providing alternatives that do not exclude.  The general premise of history must be it is a contested narrative.  

Who Has the Right to Write?

This initiative to cancel history classes until “an alternative” is decided upon in Chicago and the state is not novel or unprecedented.  The movement has its origins in the “1619 Project” launched by the New York Times Magazine.  Like all things the project has both good and bad; but the bad may outweigh the good in several ways.  

The “1619 Project” is an ongoing project developed by The New York Times Magazine in 2019 with the goal to “reframe the country’s history by placing the consequences of slavery and the contributions of black Americans at the very center of our national narrative”.  The Pulitzer Center describes the central aim of the project as a challenge “to reframe U.S. history by marking the year when the first enslaved Africans arrived on Virginia soil as our nation’s foundational date.”

Even though I do not believe the United States is unique in basking in its own origin myth, I do believe the US is unique in its history of slavery and the legacy it has imparted upon millions and millions of Americans.  So, in this sense the impetus of the project is entirely understandable; the project also simply articulates other very bad versions of history.  

It is not within the scope of this article to enter the fray of that discussion, I will simply draw your attention to The Atlantic and Politico for reviews of the debate.

My point is more philosophical.  Who has the right to write?  Basically, are we not all a product of our society and education?  Who can claim, with absolute confidence, that they have transcended social constructs and narratives to such a degree that they are free of them and in possession of the truth?

I do believe there could be some advantages to being multi-cultural, multi-racial, multi-ethnic in the sense that your very being is exposed to various narratives and constructs, thus you are innately aware of their contingent nature.

But so long as some narratives are treated as simply evil and others pure, we will simply be exchanging one piece of propaganda for another.              

https://chicagomonitor.com/2020/08/have-history-classes-just-been-cancelled-in-chicago/


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/12/historians-clash-1619-project/604093/

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/03/06/1619-project-new-york-times-mistake-122248

Didgee
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 969
Join date : 2020-06-09

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Original Quill Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:05 pm

As the Politico article by Professor Harris in rebuttal states:

Politico wrote:Overall, the 1619 Project is a much-needed corrective to the blindly celebratory histories that once dominated our understanding of the past—histories that wrongly suggested racism and slavery were not a central part of U.S. history. I was concerned that critics would use the overstated claim to discredit the entire undertaking. So far, that’s exactly what has happened.

So, the issue is not over Rep. Ford at all.  The objection is a minor debating point:  

Professor Harris, Northwestern University wrote:“…it has also become a lightning rod for critics, and that one sentence about the role of slavery in the founding of the United States has ended up at the center of a debate over the whole project.”

The College Fix article tries to introduce that idea in order to recast the whole demeanor of the debate.

As a lawyer wanting resolution, when I see that two parties are in dispute, not because they disagree, but because they are talking past one another, I find ways to simply reposition the adversaries so they do not conflict.  It’s the easiest form of conflict resolution.

This would have been easy, but the OP [College Fix] article tried to recast the issue as ‘Rep. Ford wants to stop history classes altogether’.  As I said, attention to detail about the dispute would have corrected that misapprehension.  Instead, the College Fix article wanted to twist facts, saying Rep. Ford is trying to “ban history classes”.

That was my point to begin with: He is not saying that.  In sum, all you can say is it’s a good lesson in how RW websites twist the facts to suit their deception.  They stir enough shit to create an issue where none exists.  Er...could be a Russian plant.

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 59
Location : Northern California

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Didgee Mon Aug 10, 2020 11:19 pm

lol only Quill would defend an idiot who wants to cease all history until he can introduce his own biased form of history

Which is what is happened throughout academia already

Everyone else can see the problem here except Quill as per usual

Its more than just one minor debating point

History is being open to all ideas, and views, based on the information we have. Not censuring

That is just authoritarian and basically this democrat can fuck right off

Didgee
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 969
Join date : 2020-06-09

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Original Quill Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:50 am

phil wrote:lol only Quill would defend an idiot who wants to cease all history until he can introduce his own biased form of history

I've not defended anyone like that. I'm for teaching proper, truthful history. Stop engaging in myths, and start teaching what really happened. Wink

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 59
Location : Northern California

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Ben Reilly Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:18 pm

I remember learning about slavery as a kid. I was shocked that people could have done that to one another.

But there were two things I didn't take away from that history lesson:

* That I should feel guilty because I'm white and white people did that

* Or that I should feel guilty because I'm white and white people still benefit from preferential treatment from American institutions

I can only feel guilty about a misdeed of my own. I didn't enslave anyone, nor tilt the system to my benefit. So white guilt is bullshit.

History is great for showing people how the modern world got this way, great for showing new generations the great and horrible things people have been capable of in the past.

Where it fails is when teachers present it in a way that leads students to feel like they're inheriting an ages-old conflict. Making anybody of today out like an oppressor, or a victim, for things that were done by others in the past, only perpetuates tribalism.
Ben Reilly
Ben Reilly
King of Texas. Gigantic Killer Robot. Robin Hood of Epping Forest. Fifty Shades of Cray.

Posts : 30682
Join date : 2013-01-19
Age : 49
Location : West Essex

http://www.newsfixboard.com

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Original Quill Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:29 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:I remember learning about slavery as a kid. I was shocked that people could have done that to one another.

But there were two things I didn't take away from that history lesson:

* That I should feel guilty because I'm white and white people did that

* Or that I should feel guilty because I'm white and white people still benefit from preferential treatment from American institutions

I can only feel guilty about a misdeed of my own. I didn't enslave anyone, nor tilt the system to my benefit. So white guilt is bullshit.

History is great for showing people how the modern world got this way, great for showing new generations the great and horrible things people have been capable of in the past.

Where it fails is when teachers present it in a way that leads students to feel like they're inheriting an ages-old conflict. Making anybody of today out like an oppressor, or a victim, for things that were done by others in the past, only perpetuates tribalism.

Yes...you cite a perfect example of why, and how history should be updated whenever new information is available. That is all that Rep. Ford calls for.

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 59
Location : Northern California

Back to top Go down

Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’ Empty Re: Illinois lawmaker proposes ban on history classes: They ‘lead to a racist society’

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum