Scotish, Welsh, Northern Ireland - Why Don't We Have An English Parliament?

17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Fuck off, we have discussed this ad nauseam, go back and read the other threads, it only been a day!

Sassy wrote:Fuck off, we have discussed this ad nauseam, go back and read the other threads, it only been a day!

Sassy, this may have come up in another thread, but it is a very valid question and can stand alone in a thread.

We should and it should be in ....................

lets discuss the City or Town.........

as long as it is east of the Severn and South of the A66.................

Ted Heath did his bit by signing Britain up to the so-called Common Market even though he knew that was actually the first step towards creating a United States of Europe.


We are now governed by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels.

But the specific downgrading and humiliation of England is a nasty, vindictive act committed by our Labour Government.

To secure electoral victory, the votes of Scotland and Wales are essential to Labour.

So, hoping to cement Labour’s popularity in those countries, our Scottish Prime Minister set off down the road to

devolution.

Scotland was granted its own Parliament and Wales and Northern Ireland got assemblies.


But, despite making up 85 per cent of the UK population, England got nothing. Indeed, in a further act of spite against the English, Labour tried to chop up England into self-governing regions.

They failed only because a referendum in the North-east rejected the idea.

FOLLOWING devolution we now have the bizarre and unbalanced situation whereby 50 million English are governed by a parliament in which Scottish and Welsh MPs can vote on issues that concern only England, even though they cannot vote on the same issues in their own constituencies.


http://www.express.co.uk/comment/columnists/jimmy-young/42649/The-time-has-come-to-give-England-its-own-parliament

The Barnett formula ?   

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Ask the government.

Irn Bru wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Ask the government.

Do you all think that it would be fair, and just, that England had its own Parliament, as the Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish do?

BigAndy9 wrote:.........................

Do you all think that it would be fair, and just, that England had its own Parliament, as the Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish do ?

  

DO you really think that you deserve your very own parliament, B'Andy ???

  

BigAndy9 wrote:

Irn Bru wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Ask the government.

Do you all think that it would be fair, and just, that England had its own Parliament, as the Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish do?

If that's what the people of England want then yes. And I believe there is a political party that campaigns on that so maybe you should vote for them.

Can't quite remember their name - English Democrats or something like that.

they should, it would be rather like Australia then and England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland could be states of the UK...    small states  

BigAndy9 wrote:

Irn Bru wrote:

Ask the government.

Do you all think that it would be fair, and just, that England had its own Parliament, as the Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish do?

Simples yes.

Why should elected MPs from those countries have a say in our lives when we can't in theirs.

Thank you to the last 2 posters.

I can't imagine anybody looking at the state of affairs as they are at present and not agreeing it would be fair and just.

Only out of spite and bitterness would somebody just dismiss it and mock the English for wanting to be on equal terms with the rest of the UK.

I've been saying this for ages on other forums. The only reply I get is that we don't want another tier of bureaucrats costing money. If that's the case then the Welsh Assembly and Scottish Parliament should be scrapped in the interests of fairness.

I guess it would cost a few hundred million - and it's true - that money needs to be spent on Scotland, Wales and N.I.

Oh, and we'd love to give our sick free drugs to make them better, but we need that money for Scotland, Wales and N.I.

Oh, and yes, we'd love to give our kids an education, but...

LABOUR GAVE IT ALL TO THE OTHERS SO THEY COULD HAVE THEIR VOTES.

You see folks, it isn't about money - Labour gave all those things to those countries, and brought millions of foreigners in and gave our riches to them for permanent votes for the rest of their lives.

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

scrat wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

Hi scrat, how are you?

Why do you think the Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish wanted and got a Parliament, so to speak, of their own?

scrat wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

Actually we don't Scrat we have the UK parliament at Westminster there is no English parliament. It is anachronistic that the largest country in the UK has the least say about it's own affairs. It cannot exclude Scottish Welsh Irish MPs for English only bills.

I believe it should be rectified but if theory govt can't be bothered I'm not going t worry it gives an extra boost to Labour. The right shouldn't be moaning at us have a go at the coalition.

Phoenix wrote:

scrat wrote:
Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

Actually we don't Scrat we have the UK parliament at Westminster there is no English parliament. It is anachronistic that the largest country in the UK has the least say about it's own affairs. It cannot exclude Scottish Welsh Irish MPs for English only bills.

I believe it should be rectified but if theory govt can't be bothered I'm not going t worry it gives an extra boost to Labour. The right shouldn't be moaning at us have a go at the coalition.

Hi phoenix. I don't believe anybody is having a go at anybody else - i'm asking questions that anybody can come on and give their opinion on, or if they believe they have an answer to, they can answer my questions - if they have a theory, they can put it forward.

BigAndy9 wrote:

scrat wrote:
Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

Hi scrat, how are you?

Why do you think the Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish wanted and got a Parliament, so to speak, of their own?

I'm well thanks,

The Scots and the Welsh have their own parliaments, that's cool, if they want out of the concept of Britain that's cool n all, Ulster has it's own parliament and will defend their part in being Irish and British, even the Irish wanted to be British and share in our plunder.

There is a difference between nationalism and patriotism, for me it's quite simple being English and British is perfectly interchangeable

scrat wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

It's worth remembering that that rampant "RWhinger" John Prescott was very enthusiastic about a Great Britain in which England was reduced to a couple of "United States of Europe" regions and lumped in with the French and, I think, the Scandinavians.

Fred Moletrousers wrote:

scrat wrote:
Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

It's worth remembering that that rampant "RWhinger" John Prescott was very enthusiastic about a Great Britain in which England was reduced to a couple of "United States of Europe" regions and lumped in with the French and, I think, the Scandinavians.

I had forgotten that not a good day at all.

Ah right, it seems people do want to discuss it.
I think we should have a level playing field as it were, and that means an English assembly

scrat wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:17th February 2014

Please discuss.

Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

Youve hit the nail on the head Scrat, Westminster controls the whole of Britain, and should Scotland vote yes for independence then Westinster will still control the remaining home nations...

This is Andy and his anti Scots crew feeling,left out what with Salmond's referendum.

Just what the fcuk is it Andy and co want?, Andy, ive told you lad, see Cameron about a referendum on English independence, but stop blaming everything on the Scots ffs man.

NemsAgain wrote:Ah right, it seems people do want to discuss it.
I think we should have a level playing field as it were, and that means an English assembly

Discuss what Nems?,If you want an independent England, you should raise it with your PM David Cameron, or at least with your local MP.

Are people here saying that Scotland should not be allowed to hold a referendum on independence just because some English do not want them to?

Joy Division wrote:

scrat wrote:
Andy chap! What the fuck is your problem? we're English!!!,,,we do not need our own parliament because we already have our own parliament, the British parliament is situated in London, the capital of the universe and England, get a fucking grip lad.

You and your fellow RWhingers would reduce the greatest of nations to base mediocrity.

You e not the nail on the head Scrat, Westminster controls the whole of Britain, and should Scotland vote yes for independence then Westinster will still control the remaining home nations...

This is Andy and his anti Scots crew feeling,left out what with Salmond's referendum.

Just what the fcuk is it Andy and co want?, Andy, ive told you lad, see Cameron about a referendum on English independence, but stop blaming everything on the Scots ffs man.

Exactly JD,

I'm fed up to the back teeth of whining little Englanders bleating about how hard done by they are, us English are lucky to have what we've got, next thing we'll be forced to wear Morris dancing outfits on the 23rd of April just to prove our Englishness.

scrat wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:

Hi scrat, how are you?

Why do you think the Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish wanted and got a Parliament, so to speak, of their own?

I'm well thanks,

The Scots and the Welsh have their own parliaments, that's cool, if they want out of the concept of Britain that's cool n all, Ulster has it's own parliament and will defend their part in being Irish and British, even the Irish wanted to be British and share in our plunder.

There is a difference between nationalism and patriotism, for me it's quite simple being English and British is perfectly interchangeable

Ulster is English...just transplanted.  But the rest of your post is valid.  If England wants a toy because everyone else got one, go and get it for 'em.

Original Quill wrote:

scrat wrote:
I'm well thanks,

The Scots and the Welsh have their own parliaments, that's cool, if they want out of the concept of Britain that's cool n all, Ulster has it's own parliament and will defend their part in being Irish and British, even the Irish wanted to be British and share in our plunder.

There is a difference between nationalism and patriotism, for me it's quite simple being English and British is perfectly interchangeable

Ulster is English...just transplanted.  But the rest of your post is valid.  If England wants a toy because everyone else got one, go and get it for 'em.

Hi Quill, King James the 1st, was firstly king James the VI of Scotland, most Ulstermen consider themselves Scots.

Scots are Dalradian Irish originally. Before they came, there were just Picts there.

James VI Stuart, was the son of Mary Stuart (Queen of Scots), essentially a French/Scot, and Lord Darnley, an Englishman.

Original Quill wrote:Scots are Dalradian Irish originally.  Before they came, there were just Picts there.

James VI Stuart, was the son of Mary Stuart (Queen of Scots), essentially a French/Scot, and Lord Darnley, an Englishman.

Yes the Scots are Goidelic celts, but that's all 2000 years before James planted the Scots in Ulster.

scrat wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


You e not the nail on the head Scrat, Westminster controls the whole of Britain, and should Scotland vote yes for independence then Westinster will still control the remaining home nations...

This is Andy and his anti Scots crew feeling,left out what with Salmond's referendum.

Just what the fcuk is it Andy and co want?, Andy, ive told you lad, see Cameron about a referendum on English independence, but stop blaming everything on the Scots ffs man.

Exactly JD,

I'm fed up to the back teeth of whining little Englanders bleating about how hard done by they are, us English are lucky to have what we've got, next thing we'll be forced to wear Morris dancing outfits on the 23rd of April just to prove our Englishness.

Well said Scrat, there's always one, two or a few!  

scrat wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


You e not the nail on the head Scrat, Westminster controls the whole of Britain, and should Scotland vote yes for independence then Westinster will still control the remaining home nations...

This is Andy and his anti Scots crew feeling,left out what with Salmond's referendum.

Just what the fcuk is it Andy and co want?, Andy, ive told you lad, see Cameron about a referendum on English independence, but stop blaming everything on the Scots ffs man.

Exactly JD,

I'm fed up to the back teeth of whining little Englanders bleating about how hard done by they are, us English are lucky to have what we've got, next thing we'll be forced to wear Morris dancing outfits on the 23rd of April just to prove our Englishness.

Guys I cannot think of anything more English..................What a wonderful way to celebrate our Englishness than to see you guys clog dancing and joining the superb patriotic band of the Morris Men. fantastic bunch of guys and ladies who work tirelessly for charity.

scrat wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


You e not the nail on the head Scrat, Westminster controls the whole of Britain, and should Scotland vote yes for independence then Westinster will still control the remaining home nations...

This is Andy and his anti Scots crew feeling,left out what with Salmond's referendum.

Just what the fcuk is it Andy and co want?, Andy, ive told you lad, see Cameron about a referendum on English independence, but stop blaming everything on the Scots ffs man.

Exactly JD,

I'm fed up to the back teeth of whining little Englanders bleating about how hard done by they are, us English are lucky to have what we've got, next thing we'll be forced to wear Morris dancing outfits on the 23rd of April just to prove our Englishness.

Guys I cannot think of anything more English..................What a wonderful way to celebrate our Englishness than to see you guys clog dancing and joining the superb patriotic band of the Morris Men. fantastic bunch of guys and ladies who work tirelessly for charity.

gerber wrote:

scrat wrote:
Exactly JD,

I'm fed up to the back teeth of whining little Englanders bleating about how hard done by they are, us English are lucky to have what we've got, next thing we'll be forced to wear Morris dancing outfits on the 23rd of April just to prove our Englishness.

Guys I cannot think of anything more English..................What a wonderful way to celebrate our Englishness than to see you guys clog dancing and joining the superb patriotic band of the Morris Men.  fantastic bunch of guys and ladies who work tirelessly for charity.

...I like to watch Morris dancing, it's very entertaining

gerber wrote:

scrat wrote:
Exactly JD,

I'm fed up to the back teeth of whining little Englanders bleating about how hard done by they are, us English are lucky to have what we've got, next thing we'll be forced to wear Morris dancing outfits on the 23rd of April just to prove our Englishness.

Guys I cannot think of anything more English..................What a wonderful way to celebrate our Englishness than to see you guys clog dancing and joining the superb patriotic band of the Morris Men.  fantastic bunch of guys and ladies who work tirelessly for charity.

Hey Gorgeous,

Us English do not need a national dress etc, we're English and that means we're above all that.

X

scrat wrote:

gerber wrote:

Guys I cannot think of anything more English..................What a wonderful way to celebrate our Englishness than to see you guys clog dancing and joining the superb patriotic band of the Morris Men.  fantastic bunch of guys and ladies who work tirelessly for charity.

Hey Gorgeous,

Us English do not need a national dress etc, we're English and that means we're above all that.

X

Handsome I quite agree but you will look awesome - who will be your Pig Man ?

Joy Division wrote:

gerber wrote:

Guys I cannot think of anything more English..................What a wonderful way to celebrate our Englishness than to see you guys clog dancing and joining the superb patriotic band of the Morris Men.  fantastic bunch of guys and ladies who work tirelessly for charity.

...I like to watch Morris dancing, it's very entertaining

 ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: 

Link for those that want their own parliament

http://www.englishdemocrats.org.uk/

Irn Bru wrote:Link for those that want their own parliament

http://www.englishdemocrats.org.uk/

..look how quiet it's gone!, come on BA and all the others whinging about Scots, sign up ED today!!...note no 'L' in that thankfully.

scrat wrote:

Original Quill wrote:Scots are Dalradian Irish originally.  Before they came, there were just Picts there.

James VI Stuart, was the son of Mary Stuart (Queen of Scots), essentially a French/Scot, and Lord Darnley, an Englishman.

Yes the Scots are Goidelic celts, but that's all 2000 years before James planted the Scots in Ulster.

The point is, Scarlet, that all of that shit about James VI and Scots and what they want is nonsense.  Northern Erie was overridden by Normans and then English nobles, who claimed the land in a succession of invasions from Edward I through William III.  It's no more British than Argentina.

Northern Erie belongs to the Irish, but is in the hands of invaders and occupiers.  So give it back.

Original Quill wrote:

scrat wrote:
Yes the Scots are Goidelic celts, but that's all 2000 years before James planted the Scots in Ulster.

The point is, Scarlet, that all of that shit about James VI and Scots and what they want is nonsense.  Northern Erie was overridden by Normans and then English nobles, who claimed the land in a succession of invasions from Edward I through William III.  It's no more British than Argentina.

Northern Erie belongs to the Irish, but is in the hands of invaders and occupiers.  So give it back.

Northern Erie?,,,the point is chap, you bleated,,"Ulster is English...just transplanted",,,as I stated Ulster is British and Irish, the fact that you made acunt of yourself did provide some temporary amusement, still,,, you've been learned now!

scrat wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

The point is, Scarlet, that all of that shit about James VI and Scots and what they want is nonsense.  Northern Erie was overridden by Normans and then English nobles, who claimed the land in a succession of invasions from Edward I through William III.  It's no more British than Argentina.

Northern Erie belongs to the Irish, but is in the hands of invaders and occupiers.  So give it back.

Northern Erie?,,,the point is chap, you bleated,,"Ulster is English...just transplanted",,,as I stated Ulster is British and Irish, the fact that you made acunt of yourself did provide some temporary amusement, still,,, you've been learned now!

Even a fuckin' idiot doesn't get into pissing matches he knows nothing about...what's wrong with you scarlet?  "Ulster is British and Irish," lends absolutely nothing to the debate.  You display only profound ignorance about the history of the region.

Northern Ireland is British because the hijackers came along and took it.  The entire island belongs to the Celtic Irish, and it should be given back to them.  We see all kinds of Brits running around the world wringing their hands about Palestine or East Timor, yet they still insist they own Northern Ireland.  Take a look at yourself for once.

Sorry Scrat that has to be the most idiotic argument I have heard, what next Normandy?

The reality is though the demographics of Northern has long ago changed and until people come to a consensus, there will always be a divide, as some see themselves as British first. Should Ireland be united as one nation of course, but it is not that simple without upsetting one set of people. In time this will change, more so with religion even more so the Protestant faith has been decreasing year on year and now is near level with the amount of Catholics, though this is more to do with people not having any faith.

According to the figures from the 2011 Census, which were released today, the percentage of people who are either Catholic or brought up Catholic in Northern Ireland has risen to 45% while the Protestant representation has continued to decline, falling to 48%.

However on identity:


However, the question on national identity showed that 40% of the population said they were British only, 25% said they were Irish only and 21% said they were only Northern Irish.


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/far-more-in-northern-ireland-see-themselves-as-british-rather-than-irish-28946176.html



This is far from being resolved and if more in part or full see themselves as British it is a long way off from being resolved, even though to me Ireland should be one nation

Original Quill wrote:

scrat wrote:
Northern Erie?,,,the point is chap, you bleated,,"Ulster is English...just transplanted",,,as I stated Ulster is British and Irish, the fact that you made acunt of yourself did provide some temporary amusement, still,,, you've been learned now!

Even a fuckin' idiot doesn't get into pissing matches he knows nothing about...what's wrong with you scarlet?  "Ulster is British and Irish," lends absolutely nothing to the debate.  You display only profound ignorance about the history of the region.

Northern Ireland is British because the hijackers came along and took it.  The entire island belongs to the Celtic Irish, and it should be given back to them.  We see all kinds of Brits running around the world wringing their hands about Palestine or East Timor, yet they still insist they own Northern Ireland.  Take a look at yourself for once.

Well Quim,,,,you did say that Ulster was stolen by the English, it was not, and only a imbecile would consider the British people as solely English, the fact that Ulster-men consider themselves Scots appears to have come as a surprise to you, but not to me, I'm English,,,,,and extremely proud of our sea robber ways.

Obviously you do not understand the complexities of the subject matter, you see chap, Scotland, Wales and yes,,,,Ireland shared in our glory.

It does not sadden me, that the Scots, the Welsh, the Irish and one quarter of the planet surface was colonised by the English and their language because the empire was shared, and one ought to remember that the Scots have had as troublesome a history with Ireland as us English.

Perhaps if you smear some shit on a wall you might feel better!

A most excellent poet, once remarked,,,,"put an Irishman on a spit,,,and you'll always find another Irishman to turn him""

scrat wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Even a fuckin' idiot doesn't get into pissing matches he knows nothing about...what's wrong with you scarlet?  "Ulster is British and Irish," lends absolutely nothing to the debate.  You display only profound ignorance about the history of the region.

Northern Ireland is British because the hijackers came along and took it.  The entire island belongs to the Celtic Irish, and it should be given back to them.  We see all kinds of Brits running around the world wringing their hands about Palestine or East Timor, yet they still insist they own Northern Ireland.  Take a look at yourself for once.

Well Quim,,,,you did say that Ulster was stolen by the English, it was not, and only a imbecile would consider the British people as solely English, the fact that Ulster-men consider themselves Scots appears to have come as a surprise to you, but not to me, I'm English,,,,,and extremely proud of our sea robber ways.

Obviously you do not understand the complexities of the subject matter, you see chap, Scotland, Wales and yes,,,,Ireland shared in our glory.

It does not sadden me, that the Scots, the Welsh, the Irish and one quarter of the planet surface was colonised by the English and their language because the empire was shared, and one ought to remember that the Scots have had as troublesome a history with Ireland as us English.

Perhaps if you smear some shit on a wall you might feel better!

A most excellent poet, once remarked,,,,"put an Irishman on a spit,,,and you'll always find another Irishman to turn him""

pmsl

PhilDidge wrote:Sorry Scrat that has to be the most idiotic argument I have heard, what next Normandy?

The reality is though the demographics of Northern has long ago changed and until people come to a consensus, there will always be a divide, as some see themselves as British first. Should Ireland be united as one nation of course, but it is not that simple without upsetting one set of people. In time this will change, more so with religion even more so the Protestant faith has been decreasing year on year and now is near level with the amount of Catholics, though this is more to do with people not having any faith.

According to the figures from the 2011 Census, which were released today, the percentage of people who are either Catholic or brought up Catholic in Northern Ireland has risen to 45% while the Protestant representation has continued to decline, falling to 48%.

However on identity:


However, the question on national identity showed that 40% of the population said they were British only, 25% said they were Irish only and 21% said they were only Northern Irish.


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/far-more-in-northern-ireland-see-themselves-as-british-rather-than-irish-28946176.html



This is far from being resolved and if more in part or full see themselves as British it is a long way off from being resolved, even though to me Ireland should be one nation

Hi Didglet, your opening paragraph appears to be somewhat misleading, as the rest of your post confirms the fact that Ulster is indeed British and not English.

Perhaps you would care to clarify.

Ulster is indeed Irish and British, just as Glasgow is Scots and British, the right honourable gentleman Scrat is correct.

---

Joy Division wrote:Ulster is indeed Irish and British, just as Glasgow is Scots and British, the right honourable gentleman Scrat is correct.

Hi JD, I hate to say this but there's a hint of an anti-English agenda in all of this, I've always enjoyed banter, but a few colonists need to have their filthy colonial mouths washed out with carbolic soap.

The English that I know, want Britain to succeed, they support the Scots on their wish for a referendum and hope and pray that the Scots will vote better together, and vote no to independence, it's not about the money, or the oil or even the crown, it's about the peoples of these islands and these islands of Britain include Ulster. I'm sick of England sending shitehawks like "dave" and "Bowie" bleating drivel on our behalf, we're proud to be British, we're proud of the Scots, the Welsh, and the Irish!

Some people need to stand back and look at the bigger picture, do they honestly believe that as individual nations we'll be better off?