How much should a living wage be?...

heavenly father wrote:I watched a program and they listed all the essential items to live, gathered from loads of people and worked how much to buy and sustain and I think it worked out you need about 25 grand a year minimum..

sphinx wrote:

heavenly father wrote:I watched a program and they listed all the essential items to live, gathered from loads of people and worked how much to buy and sustain and I think it worked out you need about 25 grand a year minimum..

This was being discussed a few weeks back on another thread - something about a single person needing £286 a week after housing costs had been covered.

I thought it the most hysterical thing I had ever read.

heavenly father wrote:

sphinx wrote:

heavenly father wrote:I watched a program and they listed all the essential items to live, gathered from loads of people and worked how much to buy and sustain and I think it worked out you need about 25 grand a year minimum..

This was being discussed a few weeks back on another thread - something about a single person needing £286 a week after housing costs had been covered.

I thought it the most hysterical thing I had ever read.

it's like come budget day and they talk about an average earning family, where do they get these ridiculous figures from..

Beekeeper wrote:  OBVIOUSLY, JD, that will depend on such factors as, for example :
* your country;
* city, suburban or rural locale ?
* whether you own, rent or board in a house, flat or cardboard box;
* your ability to take care of yourself;
* transport options..     

IN Australia, for a full-time worker (38 hrs) you would be talking about ~

Single person :
IN regional areas - over $30,000AUD a year gross (i.e. inc. taxes)
IN capital cities - over $50,000 a year (someone on a "minimum wage"  can only exist by sharing a house or flat with others, because of the extreme real estate costs in the bigger cities..)

Married couples :
Regional -  over $50,000
Capital cities - over $70,000 for Sydney, Melbourne or Perth; $60,000 for Brisbane or Adelaide..

Salaries and wages don't factor location into their normal loadings and calculations  in Australia ~ it is up to the employer to offer "above award" packages to entice potential employees to work for them.

heavenly father wrote:

£285 a week is not outrageous at all...

Beekeeper wrote:

heavenly father wrote:

£285 a week is not outrageous at all...

IT'S also not nearly enough for somebody to survive on in a typical suburban neighbourhood, where rents will take more than half to start with ~ and then there's the transport and other overheads to get to-and-from that "minimum wage" job..

Sphinx must have a pretty low sense of the value of her own self-worth, IF she considers that her work is ONLY worth £285 for a 38-hour week !

A LOT of people could actually find themselves even "going backwards" if they are forced into accepting that 'minimum wage' job, especially if it's some distance from their existing home..

Beekeeper wrote: 

"Minimum wage"  jobs can work out if a single person has family to stay with, or friends to share the rent, and they live reasonably close to the work...

BUT ~ force them to shift, or make them pay more simply to survive and get by ~ and you could obviously just be forcing them into a lot of strife and misery..  

sphinx wrote:I dont suppose anyone noted that not only was sphinxs figure amended by £100 to £185

But

THAT WAS THE AMOUNT REQUIRED AFTER HOUSING COSTS.

So £200 a week rent means minimum income of £385 a week.

However everyone keep feeling free to pull random figures out of the air in the meantime tens of thousands will continue to be happy on far less and laugh themselves silly at people telling them they are not getting enough to live on.

grumpy old git wrote:so those who need to use the food banks dont exist?
those who "skip meals" in order to make sure their kids eat dont exist?

sphinx wrote:I dont suppose anyone noted that not only was sphinxs figure amended by £100 to £185

But

THAT WAS THE AMOUNT REQUIRED AFTER HOUSING COSTS.

So £200 a week rent means minimum income of £385 a week.

However everyone keep feeling free to pull random figures out of the air in the meantime tens of thousands will continue to be happy on far less and laugh themselves silly at people telling them they are not getting enough to live on.

BigAndy9 wrote:

grumpy old git wrote:so those who need to use the food banks dont exist?
those who "skip meals" in order to make sure their kids eat dont exist?

They probably drink, smoke and fill their tax-payer funded houses with gadgets, then whinge about food banks and skipping meals.

Joy Division wrote:Looks like Andy should join Sphinx in the deniers corner   

BigAndy9 wrote:ok ok ok...


So there are people who need food banks, parents skipping meals.

Surely quite a few over the past few years are dying?

Thousands of skinny malnourished kids wandering the streets?

Come on - there must be!  Some groups are saying there are millions in this country living in poverty.  When I did my aid work in Africa the word poverty usually meant death.

Catman wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:ok ok ok...


So there are people who need food banks, parents skipping meals.

Surely quite a few over the past few years are dying?

Thousands of skinny malnourished kids wandering the streets?

Come on - there must be!  Some groups are saying there are millions in this country living in poverty.  When I did my aid work in Africa the word poverty usually meant death.

Well we will be hitting the food reserves, for one week this month.

BigAndy9 wrote:

Catman wrote:

Well we will be hitting the food reserves, for one week this month.

Food reserves?

Unfortunately, we can't afford reserves - we work.

Oh, and to the person who is grumbling about somebody else putting a new boiler in to her house - yes, we desperately need a new boiler but can't afford one - if ours breaks, it breaks.  

Come and live in the real world, people!

Sassy wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:


Food reserves?

Unfortunately, we can't afford reserves - we work.

Oh, and to the person who is grumbling about somebody else putting a new boiler in to her house - yes, we desperately need a new boiler but can't afford one - if ours breaks, it breaks.  

Come and live in the real world, people!

Oh give it a rest Andy, I wasn't grumbling, my landlord is lovely and it would be total upheaval to change it as it is a back boiler on a fire (that's how old it is).   However, it does make the gas bills high.   If you can't change your boiler, you have obviously not been saving for a rainy day lol, very bad management.   My other half works very long hours at 63, he normally leaves at 5.30 in the morning, sometimes isn't back until 8 if an emergency comes up or a survey needs doing quickly, for very little money.   My grandaughter works as well, only waitressing while she looks for something else, but she's still at work at the moment, did a split shift today, 12 - 5, 8 - finish, which will probably be 2 am.   She does that for minimum wages for under 21s and works as many hours as they give her.  And I worked all my life except for a short while when I had my kids and retired at 60.   Now do fuck off and moan somewhere else.

PS, if you don't have food reserves either in these days of freezers and buy one get one free, you're just plain dumb.

PPS But you're the one that seems to have an android phone, and you are waiting for "dev kit 2" of the oculus rift etc etc etc, perhaps for your families sake you should use the money for a new boiler.  It's all about priorities Andy, and yours seem very odd.

sphinx wrote:
I dont suppose anyone noted that not only was sphinxs figure amended by £100 to £185

But

THAT WAS THE AMOUNT REQUIRED AFTER HOUSING COSTS.

So £200 a week rent means minimum income of £385 a week.

However everyone keep feeling free to pull random figures out of the air in the meantime tens of thousands will continue to be happy on far less and laugh themselves silly at people telling them they are not getting enough to live on.

BigAndy9 wrote:

Sassy wrote:

Oh give it a rest Andy, I wasn't grumbling, my landlord is lovely and it would be total upheaval to change it as it is a back boiler on a fire (that's how old it is).   However, it does make the gas bills high.   If you can't change your boiler, you have obviously not been saving for a rainy day lol, very bad management.   My other half works very long hours at 63, he normally leaves at 5.30 in the morning, sometimes isn't back until 8 if an emergency comes up or a survey needs doing quickly, for very little money.   My grandaughter works as well, only waitressing while she looks for something else, but she's still at work at the moment, did a split shift today, 12 - 5, 8 - finish, which will probably be 2 am.   She does that for minimum wages for under 21s and works as many hours as they give her.  And I worked all my life except for a short while when I had my kids and retired at 60.   Now do fuck off and moan somewhere else.

PS, if you don't have food reserves either in these days of freezers and buy one get one free, you're just plain dumb.

PPS But you're the one that seems to have an android phone, and you are waiting for "dev kit 2" of the oculus rift etc etc etc, perhaps for your families sake you should use the money for a new boiler.  It's all about priorities Andy, and yours seem very odd.

The Oculus Rift was bought for $300 and sold for £400.

The phones, tablets, courtesy of work.

I am an I.T. guru after all.

BigAndy9 wrote:ok ok ok...


So there are people who need food banks, parents skipping meals.

Surely quite a few over the past few years are dying?

Thousands of skinny malnourished kids wandering the streets?


NO, but....there are some, and the number is increasing...there is an increasing level of vitamin deficiency being noted...and may teachers have described kids coming to school with no breakfast or packed lunch etc.....

Come on - there must be!  Some groups are saying there are millions in this country living in poverty.  When I did my aid work in Africa the word poverty usually meant death.  surely thats the point...we are NOT africa, we are (supposedly) a civilised and relatively affluent nation.....It shouldnt be allowed ,,,EVER....to come to that