12 Hour Night Shifts On 111 Service

This is a ridiculous length of time to be at work, should be illegal unless you are in the armed forces during conflict.

Emma Alsopp, 22, died after hanging herself during her break from work

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3420512/NHS-111-call-centre-worker-hanged-staff-toilet-end-four-12-hour-night-shifts-trust-missed-fatal-sepsis-tragic-one-year-old.html#ixzz3yXJqZSrZ
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That's awful - the poor girl.

I've rung that line before, and I'm full of praise for them. They need to look after the staff - they must get a lot of calls from distressed people, which is bound to get to them after a while.

I helped organised and train people on pathways in centers alongside GP's.
One of the saddest things for these call handlers to bear is when they lose someone whilst on the phone. As part of the training we had to play back calls where such sad events happened. Which could be anything from just taking the first details of them complaining of a chest pain to then that person having a massive heart attack, where you actually hear the phone drop and the person fall to the floor. BY the time the ambulance is there with the Police to break in, sadly the person has died. There was nothing the caller could have done to prevent this happening, but the emotional effect it has on them is over bearing, as they will sadly blame themselves.

Staff in these situations should do no more than an 8 hour shift as even without such a situation they have to deal with Palliative patients, their families, vulnerable patients, where it will be known if the patient is in care, been abused, or a known offender on the phone, as their details on our the NHS database. So through all this, they have to keep as normal as possible, which is difficult, dealing with call after call. It is a decent system, designed to rule out how urgent something is. Which is not full proof but does work well.

Its a very difficult job for people who have no medically trained and how guide people though calls to only attempt to rule out how urgent the problem is and they get so much abuse, where people ring up so impatient demanding to see a doctor.

Wow I didn't know that didge.
12 hours of work is hard enough for most people but for a traumatic and emotional job such as this....it's terrible!

eddie wrote:Wow I didn't know that didge.
12 hours of work is hard enough for most people but for a traumatic and emotional job such as this....it's terrible!

Yep saw some in tears and had to go home after some calls.
They actually pay them quite well though for a call center job, but even then its very distressing for the call handlers at time.
People ring up thinking they are medically trained, when that is not their job.
Their job is to assess the patient through a series of questions
For example if a caller answers only one or two questions where it cannot rule our urgency, it will be 999.
Followed by A&E
See a GP within 2 hours
Speak to GP within 1 hour
See GP within 6 hours
and so on


I will tell you a secret though, by law, if a patient rings up 3 times within 24 hour period off the same problem, they have to be seen by a OOH GP.
This was due to a patient dying off meningitis a few years back before Pathways was implimented

Don't you think though, seeing as you have seen this firsthand, that they should receive better training?
Are the operators offered councelling?

eddie wrote:Don't you think though, seeing as you have seen this firsthand, that they should receive better training?
Are the operators offered councelling?

They have a 4 week course Eddie, which they have to pass the tests.
They then have to shadow an experienced call handler, before being allowed on their own.
Yes they are offered counselling, where I helped
Again their job is to assess the level of urgency, which the system probes through a series of questions.
They have nurses and GP's in the call centre also to help if unsure
They have an option on calls also to do this, if they feel it could be serious where the patient is vague on answering.
Also where a patient cannot say either yes or no to a few questions, it cannot then rule out many issues, and it becomes urgent.
Its not fool proof, but its better than systems before
999 and 111 use the exact same system

Ah ok. Still think 12 hour shifts are unacceptable and not beneficial to the operators or people calling them.

Mistakes can be made when you're tired.

eddie wrote:Ah ok. Still think 12 hour shifts are unacceptable and not beneficial to the operators or people calling them.

Mistakes can be made when you're tired.

Agreed and imagine the volume of calls they take throughout the day Eddie.
And you are right mistakes can be made.

The obvious question is - why did this young woman not just leave if it was making her so ill? It sounds as if it affected her deeply, and that leaving her job would not have solved that.

Raggamuffin wrote:The obvious question is - why did this young woman not just leave if it was making her so ill? It sounds as if it affected her deeply, and that leaving her job would not have solved that.

Maybe she liked her job and felt worthwhile? Needed the money?

eddie wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:The obvious question is - why did this young woman not just leave if it was making her so ill? It sounds as if it affected her deeply, and that leaving her job would not have solved that.

Maybe she liked her job and felt worthwhile?  Needed the money?

Oh there is that side to it, most definitely.
You do get people ring back and thank how call handlers have dealt with calls to compliment them, as well as complain lol.
So there is certainly a big element to a feel good factor to being part of helping people.

eddie wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:The obvious question is - why did this young woman not just leave if it was making her so ill? It sounds as if it affected her deeply, and that leaving her job would not have solved that.

Maybe she liked her job and felt worthwhile?  Needed the money?

I mean why didn't she leave rather than kill herself? She clearly didn't like the job when she decided to do that.

Of course, there might have been other factors which we don't know about.

UK governments over the years have shown scant real regard for our NHS, cuts cuts cuts, not a pun, lol.

I have worked for days on end without proper sleep, I know lack of it clouds ones judgement.
8 hours working, particularly in stressful job is more than enough.

Flight controllers are under work hours restrictions nowadays, so I have just been told.

I agree with you. Eight hours is long enough for a stressful job where you're called upon to make quick and extremely important decisions.